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Doctrines of Rumi

 
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 19777

PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2015 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mazharshah wrote:
PIDAR NOOR WA PISAR NOOR AST MASHHUR
AZZ EEN FAHUM KUN NOORUN ALA NOOR (RUMI)

Translation; It is well known father is noor and son is noor, understand this
( keep in mind ) this is noor upon noor.

I was told that in 1975 conference the will statement of MSMS ' whether they be sons or remote male issue..' came under discussion. In late 70's missionaries were told not to quote the above couplet of Rumi. Once I wrote an article for ITREB and quoted the above couplet. I was called in office by a top official and he asked me to delete that couplet. I argued and was told no more and that article never published.
Thanks for the translation.

Perhaps the reason for this verse to be objected would be that in the past some sons of the Imams rebelled against the legitimate authority.
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 3:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya Ali Madad:
Rumi was a great Sufi of 7th level intellect, nothing more.

....

Admin has failed very badly.becoming abettor of cursed.
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 19777

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nuseri wrote:
Ya Ali Madad:
Rumi was a great Sufi of 7th level intellect, nothing more.

Below are quotes from MSMS's Farmans and MHI's speech about Rumi.

If you will read the books of Mowlana Rumi and of Shah Shams Tabriz, then you would come to know about which path is good!
Mowlana Rumi first thought about himself: “Earlier, I was a stone; later on, I was created a tree; and from that, I have evolved into a human being (insan). From a human being, what shall I become hence?” He used to think about it. You, too, must think about what will you become from a human being!(Farman No.45, Jangbaar, 13.09.1899)

Mowlana Rumi has said that: “I was a stone; from there, I was created a tree; from that, I was transformed and created an ant; after that, I reached the stage of an animal. I ceased to be an animal to reach the status of a monkey. From that, I became a human being (insan). From human being (insan), what shall I become? I shall become an angel (malayak). From there, where shall I go? I shall rise higher still.”

Those who do not have the knowledge forsake the Haqiqat, but those who are Haqiqati, follow the other path. Just as (1) Hazrat Essa, (2) Pir Sadardin, (3) Nasir Khushraw, (4) Pir Shams, (5) Mowlana Rumi, and the like, followed the path of Haqiqat. This path is very difficult for the foolish persons.(Farman No.160, Dar-es-Salam, 29-09-1899)

As the poet Rumi has written: “The light that lights the eye is also the light of the heart… but the light that lights the heart is the Light of God.”(MHI Speech by Mawlana Hazar Imam At the Foundation Ceremony of
The Ismaili Centre, Toronto, The Aga Khan Museum and their Park Friday, 28 May 2010)

From the above, do you think Rumi was a person of the 7th intellect only?
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To kmaherali: Ya Ali Madad.
If you can re post the extract of the farman no 160 with 4 lines before that and 4 lines after that.
I need specific reply and not subjective status reply, before I post my status on Rumi.
1) why his Mhi called him as poet and not moulana,auliya,pirs or dai.?
2) I assume that the status of Shams Tabriz was revered n no less than a Pirs.
Why did not the poet Rumi Gave his Bayt thru Shams to the Imam of the Time?
I am ready for the debate.
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 19777

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nuseri wrote:
To kmaherali: Ya Ali Madad.
I am ready for the debate.
I have responded at:
Jelaluddin Rumi
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php?op=modload&name=phpBB2&file=viewtopic&p=52473#52473

Please go there for further debate.
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 3:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya ALI madad.
Saw that.
You are posting only what other want to read.
Which one is part of farman no 160.?
Rumi was arrogant with his status he disregarded the bayat.your answer stand no ground.
What legacy did rumi leave.
Bunch of swirling dervish,assuming to swirl around one unites with God.
grade lower than Shariatis ,low end donkies.
His work is pure n has essence,So does the work of Guru Nanak.
Imam said they took the other path.
What is that path?
In what language this original Farmans made?
Who is the translator ?.
In other farman.imam SMS has named entities to jamat to become like them.
Who are those?
I assume their crusade may have had impact.
Here the word Haqaqti is used.
What word were used in that Farman ?
Rumi work may have a place in the library for time n dimag ka dahi
What we need to follow what material avbl in JK.
Has MHI stated any farman to act on rumi's work,etc.
Do not mix n farmans to confuse readers.
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 4:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To kmaherali: Ya Ali Madad.
I have asked 4 simple questions in above post. Other can join in to reply on behalf of our learned wise member.
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tret



Joined: 09 Sep 2010
Posts: 1197

PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2016 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmaherali wrote:

If you will read the books of Mowlana Rumi and of Shah Shams Tabriz


Shams Tabriz composed a book? Which one?
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 19777

PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2016 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tret wrote:
kmaherali wrote:

If you will read the books of Mowlana Rumi and of Shah Shams Tabriz


Shams Tabriz composed a book? Which one?
A book of Shams does not necessarily mean a book composed by Shams. It could mean a book about Shams for example, Maqalat - his discourses.
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