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www.ismaili.net :: View topic - Facing Kaba'a
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Facing Kaba'a
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mazharshah



Joined: 18 Oct 2018
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmaherali wrote:
mazharshah wrote:

Yes, Avtars came in disguise of different names in yugas.
You mean that the Imam could call himself Karim one day and mazhar the following day?


Hazar Imam Shah Karim is Mazhar of Allah.
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 20750

PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mazharshah wrote:

Hazar Imam Shah Karim is Mazhar of Allah.
That means he doesn't call himself one name today and another name tomorrow. Is that right?
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mazharshah



Joined: 18 Oct 2018
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmaherali wrote:
mazharshah wrote:

Hazar Imam Shah Karim is Mazhar of Allah.
That means he doesn't call himself one name today and another name tomorrow. Is that right?


In 6th part of Du'a we recite 48 different names of Ali ( two comes twice).
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 20750

PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mazharshah wrote:

In 6th part of Du'a we recite 48 different names of Ali ( two comes twice).
48 names represent different Imams in different contexts. I ask you again does the present Imam call himself Karim today, Peter tomorrow and John the day after like you do?
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mazharshah



Joined: 18 Oct 2018
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmaherali wrote:
mazharshah wrote:

In 6th part of Du'a we recite 48 different names of Ali ( two comes twice).
48 names represent different Imams in different contexts. I ask you again does the present Imam call himself Karim today, Peter tomorrow and John the day after like you do?


Ismailis believe all Imams are Ali. So Noor e Ali is one but has different names in different eras. like in 4 Jugs he adopted various names. The last but not the least is Naklanki.
We Ismailis call or remember Imam with various names as, Ali, Shah Karim, Hazar Imam, PirShah, Pir Karim, Saheb e Zaman, Ulil Amr, Dhani Salamat, Sahebul Asr, Nijatul mou'mineen wal mou'minaat and so on.

Regarding myself, I was unknown, when became known adopted various names.
MON KEESTAM, MON KEESTAM
HANUZ DAR TAHIYUR MANDAH UM
MON KEESTAM
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 20750

PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2018 5:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mazharshah wrote:

Ismailis believe all Imams are Ali. So Noor e Ali is one but has different names in different eras. like in 4 Jugs he adopted various names. The last but not the least is Naklanki.
We Ismailis call or remember Imam with various names as, Ali, Shah Karim, Hazar Imam, PirShah, Pir Karim, Saheb e Zaman, Ulil Amr, Dhani Salamat, Sahebul Asr, Nijatul mou'mineen wal mou'minaat and so on.

Regarding myself, I was unknown, when became known adopted various names.
MON KEESTAM, MON KEESTAM
HANUZ DAR TAHIYUR MANDAH UM
MON KEESTAM
Clever! You have to distinguish titles from the names. By what titles he is known or called is different than calling himself different names as you say you do. Hence the Imam is not your role model as you say.
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mazharshah



Joined: 18 Oct 2018
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2018 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmaherali wrote:
mazharshah wrote:

Ismailis believe all Imams are Ali. So Noor e Ali is one but has different names in different eras. like in 4 Jugs he adopted various names. The last but not the least is Naklanki.
We Ismailis call or remember Imam with various names as, Ali, Shah Karim, Hazar Imam, PirShah, Pir Karim, Saheb e Zaman, Ulil Amr, Dhani Salamat, Sahebul Asr, Nijatul mou'mineen wal mou'minaat and so on.

Regarding myself, I was unknown, when became known adopted various names.
MON KEESTAM, MON KEESTAM
HANUZ DAR TAHIYUR MANDAH UM
MON KEESTAM
Clever! You have to distinguish titles from the names. By what titles he is known or called is different than calling himself different names as you say you do. Hence the Imam is not your role model as you say.


Hazar Imam is a role model. Look, what Deborah Yedlin chancellor of Calgary University said about Hazar Imam. She said," Aga Khan a MODEL for us all".
When world dignitaries say Imam is role model, why are we shying to accept him a role model.
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 20750

PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mazharshah wrote:
Hazar Imam is a role model. Look, what Deborah Yedlin chancellor of Calgary University said about Hazar Imam. She said," Aga Khan a MODEL for us all".
When world dignitaries say Imam is role model, why are we shying to accept him a role model.
I was just pointing out that he is at least not your role model because you do not follow his example.

But more generally he cannot be our model because for us he is born pure and does not need further purification and his role is unique as a guide. We on the other hand need to purify ourselves and hence we have different roles to play
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mazharshah



Joined: 18 Oct 2018
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmaherali wrote:
mazharshah wrote:
Hazar Imam is a role model. Look, what Deborah Yedlin chancellor of Calgary University said about Hazar Imam. She said," Aga Khan a MODEL for us all".
When world dignitaries say Imam is role model, why are we shying to accept him a role model.
I was just pointing out that he is at least not your role model because you do not follow his example.

But more generally he cannot be our model because for us he is born pure and does not need further purification and his role is unique as a guide. We on the other hand need to purify ourselves and hence we have different roles to play


Am I so worthy that Imam will adopt my model!! I am nothing.
Imam was born pure as you wrote, therefore he can't be God according to LUM YALID WA LUM YULAD. He who is born can't be God. I know you will play NOOR NOOR record.
Yes Ismailis follow the pure model so that they should be purified.
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 20750

PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2018 5:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mazharshah wrote:
Am I so worthy that Imam will adopt my model!! I am nothing. Imam was born pure as you wrote, therefore he can't be God according to LUM YALID WA LUM YULAD. He who is born can't be God. I know you will play NOOR NOOR record.
Yes Ismailis follow the pure model so that they should be purified.
I am pointing out to you that he is not your role model because he does not change his name to hide his identity like you do.

I have never suggested you to be worthy of being a role model.
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shivatrivedi



Joined: 02 Nov 2018
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmaherali wrote:
I am pointing out to you that he is not your role model because he does not change his name to hide his identity like you do.
I have never suggested you to be worthy of being a role model.[/quote]

Reply:

MON AANEM KE MON DANEM. I know what I am.
Never claimed to be a role model, though in future few will adopt my role model on Heritage. (my replacement)
Dus Avtars have Dus (ten) different names and Shiva has 108 attribute names. From Ali to Karim all Imams have different names except 2.
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