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agakhani
Joined: 07 May 2008
Posts: 1139
Location: AUSTIN, TEXAS. U.S.A.
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 Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 4:48 am Post subject: Ismaili.net is a good school for me to learn. |
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| Thanks for your compliments but one thing I should confess that I am a student and I am a learner, I still need to learn lots from many sources and Ismaili.net is one of that sources. |
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MR-FORGET
Joined: 28 Nov 2010
Posts: 82
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 9:08 am Post subject: |
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Mr. Virani,
Thanks for your quick reply of my 10 questions, some answeres are great and some anmswers make me more carious and suspicious!
As per my understanding, and as per your answer, Allah does have shape,
but we can not see him because he is unvisible!! like air or radium, correct me if I am wrong but this what I understand from your answers but beleive me this answer make me even more suspicious about Allah's existance why? read below one more time:-
1,If he has shape then why not anyone had seen in past and why we can't see him at present time?
2, As discussed above many followers of different religions also beleives that Allah has no shape, why they say Allah has no shap, and you the only one say Allah has shape? can you elaborate little more?
3, Give me a favor, ask your any Sunny freind about Allah's picture or ask him how Allah look like? and let me know what he says to you?
Other then these your other answers are gr8. |
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shiraz.virani
Joined: 28 May 2009
Posts: 901
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:41 am Post subject: |
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| 1,If he has shape then why not anyone had seen in past and why we can't see him at present time? |
There is one man according to holy quran who saw him and fainted and that is h.musa[as]....But I know for sure there can be others too who were fortunate enough to get the glimpse of god
Now as we know god can take any form, shape and size...what makes you think that he never watches you ??....What if comes in some sort of disguise ?? .....As I told you last time , he can be anywhere or everywhere and of this we humans have a very little knowledge.
I guess the knowledge or the secrets are scattered all accross us, its just that we have to discover them and hopefully one day we will 
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| 2, As discussed above many followers of different religions also beleives that Allah has no shape, why they say Allah has no shap, and you the only one say Allah has shape? can you elaborate little more? |
When it comes to islam many mullah stand up and say you cannot say god looks like this or god looks like that because they dont want you to associate anything with god...because as i said whatever object we use to describe allah[swt] is his very own creation....but mullahs always tend to forget that their is no harm is treating allah[swt] as and how you please because when he can take the incarnation of burning tree , he might as well talk to you via the stone...who knows ??
We dunno how jinns look like...but does that mean they dont exist ?? ....See as I said the reason why I said god for me is more human like is because god used the terms "his own hands" in quran....He moulded h.adam[as] with his own hands !!!!......And then again during the time of bayyat where allah[swt] wanted those who have faith in rasool[saw] give allegiance[bayat] and those who put their hand on rasool[saw] hand is like giving allegiance to allah[swt].....There are various things which would show that allah[swt] can be anything and everything but thats just me....Most sunni friends wont believe when you say this and that is because they have restricted themselves into their 1000 years old customs just like we ismailis still try to look for noor of allah[swt] in our present imam.
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| 3, Give me a favor, ask your any Sunny freind about Allah's picture or ask him how Allah look like? and let me know what he says to you? |
I already told you what they gonna say....for them associating anything with allah[swt] is shirkh but for me....learning and understanding what allah[swt] is the real deal !!
Allah[swt] lives in the thoughts of every true momin....the problem is he understands but we dont
Please try to read the 99 names of allah with their meaning , I think this would help ! |
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kmaherali
Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 9915
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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In one of the Farmans MHI says: "The soul is created and is given a physical form."
This means that our bodies are forms of the souls, hence the weight of our bodies is the weight of our souls. |
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agakhani
Joined: 07 May 2008
Posts: 1139
Location: AUSTIN, TEXAS. U.S.A.
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 4:16 am Post subject: |
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| There is one man according to holy quran who saw him and fainted and that is h.musa |
Shiraz,
Do you think Hazarat Musa saw Allah in his physical body? no brother nobody has claimed to seen Allah/god in face to face till today because God doesn't have any shape.
Long time ago Mahrshi Arbindo claimed that he saw God but latter on he confessed that not in physical shape but his presence around him. but other then Maharshi Arbindo no body claimed to see God and if any one claims then it it not true.
Hazarat Moses saw Allah's noor not Allah in phisical body, Allah's appearance was in light not in human shape and that is why the oak tree and mountain were burned out but Allah didn't came face to face in front of Prophet Moses in human or any other shapes. |
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agakhani
Joined: 07 May 2008
Posts: 1139
Location: AUSTIN, TEXAS. U.S.A.
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 5:02 am Post subject: |
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| In one of the Farmans MHI says: "The soul is created and is given a physical form." |
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| hence the weight of our bodies is the weight of our souls. |
If the soul weight is our bodies weight then how can soul fly after the death of human being? and our bodies can not fly? |
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kmaherali
Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 9915
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 5:58 am Post subject: |
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| agakhani wrote: |
If the soul weight is our bodies weight then how can soul fly after the death of human being? and our bodies can not fly? |
There are many theories and ideas about soul. We must follow what the present Imam says... |
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agakhani
Joined: 07 May 2008
Posts: 1139
Location: AUSTIN, TEXAS. U.S.A.
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 7:13 am Post subject: |
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| We must follow what the present Imam says... |
Of course we must follow what our Imam says and I don't mean that you quoted MHI's farman wrong.
There are many theories about 'soul' some says soul has weight some says soul doesn't weight same way you have your own theory, as per your theory soul weight is our body weight, it might be it might be not but sorry I can't accept your theory unless you give me satisfactory answer of my above question i.e. If the soul weight is our bodies weight then how soul can fly after the death from human bodies? and human bodies can not fly?
Every one has their own theory same way I have my own and very simple theory and that is soul does not have weight, and if it does have weight then not as much as our body weight that is period |
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shiraz.virani
Joined: 28 May 2009
Posts: 901
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 8:38 am Post subject: |
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Shiraz,
Do you think Hazarat Musa saw Allah in his physical body? no brother nobody has claimed to seen Allah/god in face to face till today because God doesn't have any shape.
Long time ago Mahrshi Arbindo claimed that he saw God but latter on he confessed that not in physical shape but his presence around him. but other then Maharshi Arbindo no body claimed to see God and if any one claims then it it not true.
Hazarat Moses saw Allah's noor not Allah in phisical body, Allah's appearance was in light not in human shape and that is why the oak tree and mountain were burned out but Allah didn't came face to face in front of Prophet Moses in human or any other shapes. |
Well according to the bible h.musa[as] did saw allah[swt]
Exodus 33:11
And the LORD spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend
Deuteronomy 34:10
And there arose not a prophet since in Israel like unto Moses, whom the Lord knew face to face
and then there is this passage where allah[swt] says :
Exodus 33:20-23
Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live. And the LORD said, Behold, there is a place by me, and thou shalt stand upon a rock: And it shall come to pass, while my glory passeth by, that I will put theein a clift of the rock, and will cover thee with my hand while I pass by: And I will take away mine hand, and thou shalt see my back parts: but my face shall not be seen.
So on one hand allah[swt] did spoke to him face to face and in other passage allah[swt] asks h.musa[as] to stand on the rock and he[allah] himself will help him or grant him deedar |
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tret
Joined: 09 Sep 2010
Posts: 95
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 10:25 am Post subject: |
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| shiraz.virani wrote: |
shiraz said "The greatest pleasure for momins is to get the glimpse of allah[swt]"
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Have you?
| shiraz.virani wrote: |
shiraz said "and you dont have to look at the photo of the agakhan or peer baba or saadhu santh to look for allah[swt]"
or akbar-ali?
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or akbar ali?
| shiraz.virani wrote: |
shiraz said "Most sunni friends wont believe when you say this and that is because they have restricted themselves into their 1000 years old customs just like we ismailis still try to look for noor of allah[swt] in our present imam."
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What's your innovative approach? does it work?
For all the following questions, statements, see below.
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shiraz said "it is only allah[swt] who can rid us from such things and he promised all his believers that he would show himself on judgement day"
mr-forget said "1,If he has shape then why not anyone had seen in past and why we can't see him at present time?"
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Remember, you (or anyone) can't see God. God can only be experienced. And those who truely does experience God, will never be able to explain, or describe the feeling, for there are no words in our (human's) vocabulary to describe God. |
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shiraz.virani
Joined: 28 May 2009
Posts: 901
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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I dont know whether I have or haven't because god can manifest in any form, size and shape and can help you in any kind of way.....I need not necessarily have to look at the picture of agakhan or shahrukh khan in order to find allah[swt]
Or zakir ali, muhammed ali or even nusrat ali 
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| What's your innovative approach? does it work? |
I said most sunnis and not all sunnis...there's a difference....but anyways my business partner is a sunni from pakistan who was a hardcore sunni and anti ismaili but then as time passed on he learned that ismailism is as unique as his faith is.
And you do know that I dont treat imam's = allah, well then why should I ? Because god as you said can only be experienced and not seen right ??.....But I agree to disagree with you because god can come in any shape or size and need not necessarily be trapped in one's body ...but that is my opinion !!
And then he started to learn what exactly is ismailism because as per him ladies walking near garden jk in karachi wearing all bling bling was ismailism....but later he started to adopt to the knowledge that ismailism is not anti islam its just that their way of understanding god and sharia is different than his .....Now what is he gonna do?? Fight me because my thinking is slightly different than his or just move along....he chose the later ! |
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Admin
Joined: 06 Jan 2003
Posts: 1759
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 9:40 pm Post subject: |
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I understand that God can only be experienced. I would like to know if God can see us or if He can only experience us as "seeing" is a very physical concept linked to the human eye 
But though I am dying to get a reply, this is not the place. Lets stick to the subject please. |
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agakhani
Joined: 07 May 2008
Posts: 1139
Location: AUSTIN, TEXAS. U.S.A.
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| Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 6:14 am Post subject: |
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| Let talk about soul weight, many peoples believe that soul is part of God, it is separated from God and one of day it will rejoin The god ; Innalillahi wa inna ilain rajiun. means we are came from Allah and we have to back to Allah now think about God shape, God has not shape means God has no weight either same way soul ( which is part of God) has no shape or weight. This is the solid proof that soul has no weight. |
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agakhani
Joined: 07 May 2008
Posts: 1139
Location: AUSTIN, TEXAS. U.S.A.
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| Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 6:23 am Post subject: |
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| Remember, you (or anyone) can't see God. God can only be experienced. |
Here we go Tret,
Thanks for your post, that is what I am trying to tell Shiraz for long time that nobody had saw God in Past, nobody claiming the he is being seeing god , and may be nobody will see God till the day of Kayamat.same way nobody will able to see soul because soul does not have shape or weight same like God. |
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MR-FORGET
Joined: 28 Nov 2010
Posts: 82
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| Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 9:08 am Post subject: |
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just like we ismailis still try to look for noor of allah[swt] in our present imam."
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Current Imam has Allah's noor, there should be no doubt in any Ismaili's mind and if he/she doesn't have trust that Imam doesn't have Allah's Noor then he/she should not consider themselves as an Ismaili because Imam is a holder of Allah's noor and this is basic and fundamental principle in Ismailism.
Now ask this question to your self and be your own judge. Do you accept that Imam is a holder of Allah's noor or not? and your own answer will tell you whether you are an Ismaili or not!! |
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