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Observation of traditions

 
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:54 pm    Post subject: Observation of traditions Reply with quote

YA ALI MADAD.
firstly will take a nice point by our wise member in other topic.
When MHI speaks ,same word can different facet in the context it is used for.
If one says this scientist has unique SCHOOL of thoughts and one says My child goes to a primary SCHOOL.
so the word SCHOOL is common but has different facet to be understood.there can corealtion but the scientist and child are NOT THE SAME.
here Imam means our tariqa of esoteric PATH /Tradition.
our tradition of Ginan,qasida ,etc is facet of word tradition which can be corealted to customs,culture,legacies, and ancestral beliefs and act.
Tradition usually has stamp of period from the past.and not our
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cont.....
if MHI said tariqa is an esoteric tradition and also said Ginans are wonderful tradition( word tariqa was not used).
Any clever will merge the two and interpret and say that Ginan are wonderful tariqa.
This is short of understanding MHI intellectual wave length and context and would be ignorant and foolish to say Ginan is part of tariqa.
Is is NOT ,but definetly corealted which supplements and complents our tariqa ,
Our main components of tariqa is Dua,Tasbih ,farmans and ibaddat.
Ginan ,qasidas are supplementary in practice
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

YA ALI MADAD: Our many selected ginans with qualitative ruhani essence is most beautiful part of our traditions
I observed a baatin element in one ginan heard by me recently.
The Ginan is ' TU CHET MUN MERAA'
I wish to know from members on what could it be ?
I also wish Ginan scholars and bhagats like ShamsB,Ismaili103 and Agakhani must also join in. Uphold traditions.
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

YA Ali MADAD.:
I am still awaiting observations of the valued( at caring levels) members.
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 19777

PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nuseri wrote:
Cont.....
if MHI said tariqa is an esoteric tradition and also said Ginans are wonderful tradition( word tariqa was not used).
Any clever will merge the two and interpret and say that Ginan are wonderful tariqa.
This is short of understanding MHI intellectual wave length and context and would be ignorant and foolish to say Ginan is part of tariqa.
Is is NOT ,but definetly corealted which supplements and complents our tariqa ,
Our main components of tariqa is Dua,Tasbih ,farmans and ibaddat.
Ginan ,qasidas are supplementary in practice
Our Tariqa is one of the thousands of interpretations within Islam. The Ginans Qasidas and Farmans provide this unique interpretation which defines our Tariqah. Hence Ginans, Qasidas and Farmans are the essence of our Tariqah.


"The Ginans that Pir Sadardin has bestowed upon you are the
quintessence of the Quran-e Shariff."
- Imam SMS, Source: Jangbar, July 5, 1899 (quoted by Ali Asani in
his TUI handout)

*The Holy Pirs have already given tawil and tafsir of Quran in the
Holy Ginans.

"My Farmans themselves are Ginans." (Usul-e-din)
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To kmaherali: Ya Ali Madad .
Well replied my points.
1.ayats and farman ( order ) are words of divinity/GOD.no emotions or temlrement.
2.Noor e pirantan or Sufi kallam are word of a divinely blessed person interpreting the words of divinity.
3.In khoja tradition in early years of imam SMS ( as a child imam),many gave importance to ginans as core source of inspiration over main parts of our tariqa that is Dua ,Farman and ibaadat.
4.Pirs and Syeds went thru human emotion,sentiments,temprements and immediate sorroundings around them.So composition of many varies in interpretation and many would lack the basic essence.
5.Farmans are surely 100% pure Ginans( noor) but not said that the other way round that Ginans are Farman.
6.Lack of good missionaries in Imam SMS with may be no baatin grip were able to streghten the faith of khojas.
This led to middle line split then to switch to Itnasharis.
7.Do very close study that spilt took in khojas and not MOMNAA JAMAT of Sidhpur origins.
They were strong haqiqati then.and today as well.
Imam SMS said to them that are his Sagaa and Kutumbi ,as extended part of his family and they have give him (IMAM) a residence/space in their heart.
As I see if anyone blinded in faith try to poison mind of momana in a group approach has to fear his or her life.while in khojas it may be make 1 in many thousand can be ashtrayed by a blinded devil.
My personal observation of strong Imaan of Momnas.
They give priority of Farmans,Ibaadat,Dasond and Ginans in this order still.

As for ginan a small start.(TUM CHET MUN MERAA)
The words are Must khavoo jhuta phera.
Recyle of soul on earth till qamayat.( in search or denial mode of the truth on earth itself)
My small take before I expand this.
Avoid having biiter apples, this should give rise to few questions.
Are there apples which could be bland in taste or sweet in taste.?
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To Admin:Ya Ali Madad
An extract from farman of Imam SMS made on 31-12-1893 at manjewadi.
Upon Hz Ali bringing Quran with him.
In which he said after being told by people then that already have Quran by Us man & said others will not know those 10 paras/ayat till qayamat.
But Pir Sadarddin has explained it thru ginans,follow that.
As I am sure certain hiiden parts are already in our Dua,which I have posted earlier.
Same would give light from asal old Dua and selective ruhani ginans of Pir Sadarddin.I wish if a team could be formed each with own skill set to justify the Farman of IMAM SMS of missing paras of currently published Quran floating in the market.We can make it our jubilee project. I know Gujarati but not very well ,so on going info was sought by me.
I have reasonable leads from our current Dua and need to make it broad and firm from farmans and only from ruhani essense ginans of said Pir.
If this work has been done earlier,I may not wish to duplicate it.Please give link to that topic.
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya Ali Madad:
I had question from Ginan TU CHET MUN MERA.
The connecting words MUT KHAAVO JHUTA FERA.
which mean cylces of life on earth of FALSEHOOD.the opposite of false hood that is truth.
Moment a person is haqiqati and knows God ,than cycles of Noorani phera starts to achieve marifat/tawhid with whom he he know now from each birth cycles.
One must read Naadi shastra ,that whole past lives are imprinted on your thumb n fingers, with no same person having it.Simple is JAISE KARNI WAISE BHARNI.
the bearer of the Noor can only transfer it to it's progeny on EARTH,no other human can do that feat ( that is beyond comprehension of human mind.So are the Souls( spark of the Noor are does have that choice,they also have go thru test and cycles of the earth and reborn with reward or punishments of past life cycles ( NO EASY CHUUTKARA).
IF God is here ,so are his creations.
To be continued ....
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nuseri



Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya ali madad: continuity.
This is a cosmoligcal analogy ( star have co relation is spiritual management of Soul on earth by ALi/God.
One alternate hint from Surah Noor ,the words are neither of East or west.
So the question is it north or south.
Science says that line from North pole to pole star concludes that earth is center of UNIVERSE.because ALI is there on earth.
( please note surah noor was revealed as an analogy ,so absolute connection can be discounted but definitely co relation.from cosmology in faith)
There is study of this Persian doctrine,It is not easy to understand for normal persons.
Pole star one of the brighest stars has NOT MOVED A MILLI INCH from the time of creation.It light has not changed even one lumen ( more or less over period of time.
That represent in Analogy as ALI ,then there are 5 main and a servant stars forming and known as Big Dipper ,that never change its position as well ( that represent Ahle Bayt ).
Astronomy states that are 7.2 billion stars revolving around the poles star.
1.there are creation of baby stars.
2.there are falling stars and those racinc towards the polar star and those pushed/‰going into dark outer ring.
The closest rings of 2 million++ stars bright n shilning are haqiqatis of the earth ( from all religions).
3.from 5000 years ,no single star has been seen going off from pole star AND NOR Any star is has been able to merge with it.
It is stand alone a position of Allahuahad ,nobody Gave it a birth nor it give birth that status reflect the same Ayat.
So getting united in just 70-80 years on one life is a sham.
This art n science is called Astrology ,which I do have an ability but do not wish to pursue it.
Stars do form a part in human spiritual management of ALI.
Please note by definition of NOOR as given earlier that of divine intellect still stand true n bona fide.
This analogy reflect explanation of JHUTA N SACHAA PHERA .
for million+ life cycles on EARTH.
one extract from a Ginan
DEEN KI BAAT KAHI NA JAVEE.
LAKH KARO TO HAATH NAA AAVE.
ALI ki rehmat aur nayamat see thoda saa kuch kuch haath me aata
hai
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