Farman on Homosexuality?

Aisha9 · Post by **Aisha9** » Fri May 10, 2013 11:48 am

[quote="hungama25"you would get respect from gays and lesbians but not from me , i cannot go against the law of nature and welcome fagz like you because i cannot go against the quran/rasool[saw]/imam[as] and allah[swt][/quote]
You say that homosexuality is against nature? Then would you please explain to me why it is that there are gay penguins in the Central Park Zoo in New York City, or homosexual lions, giraffes, and all sorts of other homosexual animals? If homosexuality is against nature why is it in nature?

Aisha9 · Post by **Aisha9** » Fri May 10, 2013 12:12 pm

Hungma, being so combative and abrasive is not our way. Let the infidels and the ungodly wage their wars and be harsh and divisive. As Muslims we should show kindness and love to all our brothers and sisters. We should not be causing fights amongst ourselves.
Shams and Hungma, look at Islam as a whole some of our religious leaders have talked to many educated people and come to the conclusion that homosexuality as well as transsexuality are just natural variants of human behavior. This is an imperfect world, made so by sin, and by mankind trying to make itself into a god. As a result there are all sorts of things around us causing birth defects, like autism and cleft palettes. Is it so hard to believe that the same things causing these birth defects could cause people to be born homosexual, or transsexual? Better to put your trust in those with more education than us on these matters. Better to live and let live, and show love to all our Muslim brothers and sisters.

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Fri May 10, 2013 4:52 pm

You say that homosexuality is against nature? Then would you please explain to me why it is that there are gay penguins in the Central Park Zoo in New York City, or homosexual lions, giraffes, and all sorts of other homosexual animals? If homosexuality is against nature why is it in nature?

Sister aisha, Instead of us dragging this topic to xyz pages why dont we just open the holy quran and judge in the light of it ??....Do you think Im asking too much ??

7:80-81 We also (sent) Lut: he said to his people: "Do ye commit lewdness such as no people in creation (ever) committed before you? "For ye practice your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds."

26:165-166 "Of all the creatures in the world, will ye approach males. "And leave those whom Allah has created for you to be your mates? Nay, ye are a people transgressing (all limits)!"

What do you understand from the above given aayat's aisha ?? How do you interpret them ??

Post by **Admin** » Sat May 11, 2013 3:34 am

The Imam said in the LBC interview that in Islam a marriage is a contract between a man and a women.

LBC: Et c'est pour cela que vous avez deux mariages? Le mariage civil et le mariage religieux?

AK: Non, non, non. Ça c'est une forme mais en fait le mariage n'est pas un sacrement en Islam. C'est un rapport contractuel entre un homme et une femme.

Translated:

LBC: And is that why you have two weddings: The civil wedding and the religious wedding?

AK: No, no, no. That is a form, but in fact marriage is not sacred in Islam. It is a contract between a man and a woman.

For whole interview English translation:

http://ismaili.net/Syria/interview/lbcenglish.html

For original French transcript:

http://ismaili.net/Syria/interview/lbc.html

zznoor · Post by **zznoor** » Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:53 pm

LBC: And is that why you have two weddings: The civil wedding and the religious wedding?

In Islamic countries and even in India, Imams of various Tariqas are authorized to conduct marriages. Even in Boston many Imams are licensed to conduct marriages. In that case you do not need to do civil marriage.

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:39 pm

Missouri man withheld HIV+ status from hundreds of partners due to fear of rejection

http://rt.com/usa/missouri-hiv-hundreds-rejection-480/

d.ahmad · Post by **d.ahmad** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 6:01 pm

Admin wrote: AK: No, no, no. That is a form, but in fact marriage is not sacred in Islam. It is a contract between a man and a woman.

Is a civil marriage sufficient for a couple to be halal for each other or must they do `aqd nikah as well? Marriage with ahl-e-kitab is halal so can you just take her to court for marriage and be done with it or will she have to be explained the concept of nikah and sign the contract?

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Mon Jan 20, 2014 7:45 pm

Is a civil marriage sufficient for a couple to be halal for each other or must they do `aqd nikah as well? Marriage with ahl-e-kitab is halal so can you just take her to court for marriage and be done with it or will she have to be explained the concept of nikah and sign the contract?

Ahmad bhai, as our imam has said "its a contract between the man and woman"

Now coming back to your question, you can do the nikah with her only if she accepts islam...I mean this is purely my belief and i can be wrong...For ex: if you get married to a christian lady here in USA and if she accepts/ converts to islam then yes, you have to go through the islamic law = nikah etc etc

If she does not wanna change her faith and if you are ok with that then I personally don't think that you have to do the nikah but remember, most of the countries do not accept religious marriages valid until and unless they are registered.

4 years back when I got married here in USA, the mukhi of our jamatkhana told me that I have to do the court marriage 1st and submit the certificate of marriage with the council....So I'm pretty sure that ismailis put law of the land before their religion....and this is how it should be

tret · Post by **tret** » Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:11 am

shiraz.virani wrote:...So I'm pretty sure that ismailis put law of the land before their religion....and this is how it should be

I beg to differ on that one.

Let me ask you a question, which may give your answer.

Which one is important to you -- here in USA -- court marriage (certificate of marriage is important, for paperwork, formality, etc..etc...), or our nikah? I mean when you were back home (I assume you aren't american?), which one was important?

I know in back home (and even here in Canada), our nika (khutba of nikah) is of much more important than court marriage. Again, court marriage is of importance, when it comes to paperwork and etc.. etc.. but if you look from cultural/religious perspective, our nikah is of importance.

a_27826 · Post by **a_27826** » Thu Jan 23, 2014 1:07 am

shiraz.virani wrote:
So I'm pretty sure that ismailis put law of the land before their religion....and this is how it should be
If true, then its pretty disturbing statement.

But then why generalize it to Ismaili Muslims only ?

Do Muslims kill Apostates in USA ?

zznoor · Post by **zznoor** » Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:09 pm

I live in USA

In my state certain Imams (Prayer or Mosque leaders) has permission do do Nikah and register marriage. In that case, couple don't have to go to court for civil marriage.

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Thu Jan 23, 2014 7:10 pm

Tret said :

I beg to differ on that one.

Let me ask you a question, which may give your answer.

Which one is important to you -- here in USA -- court marriage (certificate of marriage is important, for paperwork, formality, etc..etc...), or our nikah? I mean when you were back home (I assume you aren't american?), which one was important?

I know in back home (and even here in Canada), our nika (khutba of nikah) is of much more important than court marriage. Again, court marriage is of importance, when it comes to paperwork and etc.. etc.. but if you look from cultural/religious perspective, our nikah is of importance.

Brother tret, we all have our own views and each one is entitled to it....For some its marriage according to our kriyas thats valid and for some it may be court marriage that is lawful and legal.

Anyways a sunni friend of mine in hyderabad,AP [where I'm from] got married recently and even though the marriage was performed by some mullah, their marriage was registered @ WAKF Board of HYDERABAD.

Now this board was formed in the year 1954 ...The sole purpose of this board was to look after the muslim wakf properties, wakf institutions and maintain muslim marriage records for legal purposes.

This WAKF board is not just in my city or state, this WAKF board is in almost every state of INDIA.

If you ask me personally which marriage you would prefer well Im already married, hehe....But if for some reason my wife leaves me then heck yeah Ill go with court marriage.......The money spent of court marriages is much less that money spent on customary marriages

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Thu Jan 23, 2014 7:15 pm

a_27826 said :

If true, then its pretty disturbing statement.

But then why generalize it to Ismaili Muslims only ?

Do Muslims kill Apostates in USA ?

Are yaar....I din't mean to disrespect any other sects or religion

All I meant was previously few jamatkhana's in India and USA used to perform nikah even without registered court marriage but now its been changed....You have to do a court marriage 1st before you can perform customary marriage. Hence, ismailis put law of the land before religion. What is wrong with that ???

tret · Post by **tret** » Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:04 pm

shiraz.virani wrote: If you ask me personally which marriage you would prefer well Im already married, hehe....But if for some reason my wife leaves me then heck yeah Ill go with court marriage.......The money spent of court marriages is much less that money spent on customary marriages

I am glad you'r happily married, and I wish your marriage last a lifetime.

If you are preferring court marriage over our nikah, because of $ cost, I guess you are mistaken the wedding reception with nikah ceremony itself.

Nikah is a khutbah which is recited in JK, and Mukie/Kamdiah sahebs give blessings to the newly weds.

Whereas the wedding reception is held at some banquet halls where the cost is associated. And it directly depends on the newly wed how much they want to spend (at least in our tradition). You could spend a reasonable amount of money, or you could go crazy and spend a whole lot.

But like you said, everyone's entitled to their own opinions, but I believe as far as our tariqa is concern, nikah khutba still takes precedent [where I am at now, Canada].

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:28 pm

Tret said :

I am glad you'r happily married, and I wish your marriage last a lifetime.

If you are preferring court marriage over our nikah, because of $ cost, I guess you are mistaken the wedding reception with nikah ceremony itself.

Nikah is a khutbah which is recited in JK, and Mukie/Kamdiah sahebs give blessings to the newly weds.

Whereas the wedding reception is held at some banquet halls where the cost is associated. And it directly depends on the newly wed how much they want to spend (at least in our tradition). You could spend a reasonable amount of money, or you could go crazy and spend a whole lot.

Brother tret, I said this in a fun way...Of course there's a difference between nikah and wedding reception but nikah and wedding reception are like husband and wife...Its a situation where one tries to save you some money [nikah = affordable = cheap = Husband] while the other tries to spend it all [reception = Tooo freaking expensive = wife

]

tret · Post by **tret** » Thu Jan 23, 2014 10:17 pm

shiraz.virani wrote:Tret said :

I am glad you'r happily married, and I wish your marriage last a lifetime.

If you are preferring court marriage over our nikah, because of $ cost, I guess you are mistaken the wedding reception with nikah ceremony itself.

Nikah is a khutbah which is recited in JK, and Mukie/Kamdiah sahebs give blessings to the newly weds.

Whereas the wedding reception is held at some banquet halls where the cost is associated. And it directly depends on the newly wed how much they want to spend (at least in our tradition). You could spend a reasonable amount of money, or you could go crazy and spend a whole lot.
Brother tret, I said this in a fun way...Of course there's a difference between nikah and wedding reception but nikah and wedding reception are like husband and wife...Its a situation where one tries to save you some money [nikah = affordable = cheap = Husband] while the other tries to spend it all [reception = Tooo freaking expensive = wife ]

I see. I like the analogy though

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 12:44 pm

http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/o ... -1.2673832

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 12:51 pm

https://www.theroot.com/articles/cultur ... -massacre/

kmaherali · Post by **kmaherali** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 1:58 am

Related thread at:

Homosexuality

http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... 8&start=15

swamidada_1 · Post by **swamidada_1** » Thu Mar 28, 2019 9:16 pm

HomeWorld News
Brunei’s law mandating STONING TO DEATH of gays & adulterers to come into force next week
Published time: 28 Mar, 2019 20:01

Brunei’s law mandating STONING TO DEATH of gays & adulterers to come into force next week
Sultan Haji Hassanal Bolkiah of Brunei Darussalam

A harsher version of penal code, which includes sharia-based punishments for things like adultery and same-sex relations, is to come into force next week in Brunei. The ‘human rights defenders’ in Washington, however, are silent.
Brunei, a tiny Muslim-majority absolute monarchy located in Southeastern Asia is about to put into force the last amendment to its criminal code as part of a reform initiated back in 2014. The renewed code, which is aimed at reflecting Islam’s tenets of morality and punishment for those who break them, will include caning and even stoning to death of Muslims, who are found guilty of adultery, sodomy and rape.

Brunei’s plan to stone gays riles UN
The government wanted to roll in the new laws in stages, but put the process on pause after international public outcry over the milder phase one, which included fines and jail terms for offenders, but not corporal punishment. Last week a rights group reported that Brunei quietly announced earlier this year the date, when the harsher version of the code would come into force: April 3.

“We are trying to get pressure placed on the government of Brunei but realise there is a very short time frame until the laws take effect,” Matthew Woolfe an Australia-based founder of the group, the Brunei Project, told Reuters. “It took us by surprise that the government has now given a date and is rushing through implementation.”

Homosexuality was outlawed in Brunei even before the 2014 reform and in fact since colonial times, with jail sentences of up to 10 years possible. If its government goes ahead with the plan, the nation will become the first in Asia to allow punishing gay people by death. At the moment only a handful of nations like Afghanistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia and Yemen have such provisions in their law.

The news has horrified some international rights groups. Amnesty International, in particular, decried the introduction of “cruel and inhuman penalties” and called on the world to “urgently condemn Brunei’s move to put these cruel penalties into practice.”

However, such a situation would probably surprise no one. The fact that another of Washington’s major allies – Saudi Arabia – also punishes same-sex relations by death – alongside adultery, apostasy and blasphemy – never stopped the US from striking billions-worth of deals with Riyadh.

www.rt.com/news/455006-brunei-gays-sharia-stoning/