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Kalame Mowla
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2003 5:24 am    Post subject: Kalame Mowla Reply with quote

Does anyone know a little bit of history behind "Kalame Mowla"? I have reviewed the Library and Ginan sections but haven't found answers to certain questions such as when Hazrat Ali wrote it, why at that time, and appropriate times to sing it at Jamat Khana, as we rarely hear it aside from Mowlano Rojo or at funeral ceremonies? Thank you.
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nagib



Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Posts: 295

PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2003 11:15 am    Post subject: Re: Kalame Mowla Reply with quote

Kalame Mowla is a work which only claims to be translation into Hindi of sayings of Imam Ali. Some verses are recited when there is death because some verses of this work talk of this subject. Sometime it is recited on Thursday night or for Mowla jo Rojo but those days, Chogadias should be recited...

There is at least one manuscript written in the 1800s' which claims that Pir Shams is the author of Kalame Mowla. All of the old manuscripts are giving this work as a continuous text and the first 3 lines recited in the begining nowadays are not in any of the old manuscripts. It looks like someone divided or re-aranged Kalame Mowla into chapters and gave a title to each of the chapters.

Hope this clarifies.

nagib
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 18995

PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The following are sayings of Hazarat Ali and therefore can be regarded as "Kalame Mowla", though not in the Ginanic sense that we are accustomed to. They are quite profound and worthy of deep reflection.

Wise Saying’s of 4th Rightful Caliph of Islam

"The Master of Believer's": Ali ibn Abi Talib


Fear God and you will have no cause to fear any one

Resignation to the Will of God is the cure of the disease of the heart

The word of God is the medicine of the heart

Lead such a life, that, when you die, the people may mourn you, and while you are alive they long for your company

The days of life pass away like clouds, so do good while you are alive

Of all the follies the greatest is to love the world

Opportunity is swift of flight but slow to return

The most happy is he to whom God has given a good wife

He who knows himself knows God

Do not soil your conscience for anything but heaven

The disease of the heart is worse than the disease of the body

To fight against one's desires is the greatest of all fights

The strongest amongst you is he who subdues his self

Wealth and greed are the roots of all evils

Riches without faith are the greatest poverty

A man's worth depends upon the nobility of his aspirations

Knowledge enlivens the soul

The learned lives, although he dies

The sum total of excellence is knowledge

To respect the learned is to respect God

Generosity hides shortcomings

The wealth of a miser is as useless as a pebble

Desire is one's most inveterate enemy

Those who walk on the surface of the earth shall one day be interred in it

Every breath of man brings him nearer to death

People are asleep as long as they are alive; they are awakened when they die

Patience is the fruit of faith

Virtue never dies

A man's glory from his virtue is greater than the glory of his pedigree

No shelter is safer than piety

A man's behaviour is the index of his mind

Courtesy costs nothing but buys everything

Clemency graces power

Jealousy devours virtue as fire devours fuel

He that lends a listening ear to reproach is one of those that deserve reproach

Forgiveness is the crown of greatness

Carnal appetites are nets spread by the devil

Every arrow does not hit the mark, nor every prayer granted

Ostentatiousness spoils prayers

Fear none but your sins

He who praises you murders you

A man who praises himself displays his deficiency of intellect

Honour your parents and your sons will honour you

A man is hid under his tongue

The tongue of a wise man lies behind his heart

The tongue pierces deeper than the spear

He who purifies his heart from doubt is a believer

The opinion of a wise man is an oracle

To seek counsel is to go to the fountain of guidance

Association with a fool is tyrannical to the soul

God hastens the fall of tyrants

Tyranny leads to moral cowardice

A tyrant's success is his moral defeat

It is better to die than to beg

When a man begs he loses his faith

Hajj is the Jihad of every believer in faith

A wise enemy is better than a foolish friend

Silence is the best reply to a fool

The best speech is one that is short and reasonable

Speech is like a medicine, a small dose of which cures but an excess of which kills

He that has no courage has no religion

His grief is long whose hope is short

The right of freedom of speech consists in speaking the truth

Repentance washes away sins

Folly is an incurable disease

To assist the wrong is to oppress the right

Sinning is a disease, repentance is its medicine, and abstinence from it a sure cure

Sorrow makes a man old before his time

Pride impedes progress and mars greatness

To forgive is the crown of greatness

He who understands humanity seeks solitude

Right is the best argument

Misrepresentation spoils narration

As a man's wisdom increases, so his desire to speak decreases

He who seeks to do justice with men, let him desire for them what he desires for himself

The greatest sin is the sin that the sinner considers to be ordinary

Contentment is the asset which is never exhausted

Governments are a trial for men

He who fights against the truth, the truth will defeat him

Finding fault in others is one's greatest fault

Haste is a species of madness

Greed is perpetual enslavement

He who does not know his own worth is doomed to destruction

The best investment is one with which duties are performed

Anger is a fire kindled, he who restrains anger extinguishes the fire; he who gives vent to it is the first to be consumed by such fire

Jihad is the highway of prosperity

None is more solitary than a miser

Knowledge is the ornament of the rich, and the riches of the poor

Knowledge is the sum total of excellence

He who teaches you a letter binds you with a fetter of gratitude

As long as we do not hope, we do not fret

He who indulges in jokes and loose fall, loses a part of his wisdom

Truth is bitter, but its result is sweet; falsehood appears to be sweet but it is poisonous in its effect

Miserliness is the root of many evils

Knowledge and practice are twins, and both go together. There is no knowledge without practice, and no practice without knowledge

He who dissembles plays with his honour

When God wants to humiliate a person He deprives him of knowledge

When your power increases, decrease your desires accordingly

He who listens to a backbiter loses a friend

It is no justice to decide a case on mere conjecture

He who does not know his own worth is deemed to ignominy

He who practices thrift would never be in want

He who does not know should not be ashamed to learn

Patience is to faith, what head is to the body, when patience goes, faith goes, when head goes, the body goes

The grace of God is the best guide

A good disposition is the best companion

Wisdom is the best friend

Good breeding is the best inheritance

There is nothing more hateful than pride

Be among men like bee among birds

Mix with the people with your tongue, but be separate from them in your deeds

Be generous but do not be a spendthrift

Do not run after the world; let the world run after you

A wise man is he who does not despair of the bounty and mercy of God

He who is aware of his own faults is oblivious of the faults of others

What the eye sees the heart preserves

The vision of the eye is limited; the vision of the heart transcends all barriers of time and space

Do not be misled by appearances for these are apt to be deceptive

Do not have too many irons in the fire; concentrate on one thing at a time

What you do not like for your self, do not like it for others

Contentment is the treasure which is never exhausted

The advice of old men is dearer than the bravery of young men

That knowledge is superficial which is merely on the tongue; that knowledge is real which demonstrates itself in your practice

Waste of time is one's greatest loss

He who knows to keep his secret knows the way to success

Foresight is the way to safety

No relationship is stronger than the relationship that exists between man and God

Enlighten the heart with prayers

Strengthen your heart with faith

Suppress all lust with piety

Do not sell the Hereafter for the world

Do not speak in a state of ignorance

Refrain from unnecessary talk

Do not tread the path from which you can apprehend the danger of running astray

In the affairs of God, do not be afraid of the accusations of the evil mongers

In all that you do seek the protection of God

Do not covet what is undesirable

If you seek the truth, neither strays from the right path, nor be assailed by doubts

Do not become a slave of your desires

That wealth is no wealth which brings dishonour

Whatever harm accrues of silence can be remedied but whatever harm is done because of speech cannot be remedied

It is better to restrain your desires than to stretch your hand before others

A little that is earned because of honest labour is better than a larger amount gained through dishonest means

Guard well your secret

He who seeks more than what is necessary indulges in error

To oppress the weak is the worst tyranny

Do not bank on false hopes, for that is the capital of the dead

A wise man takes a lesson even from a minor lapse

Overpower desires and suspicions by patience and faith

He who does not take the middle course strays

A stranger is he who has no friends

When hopes are frustrated despair becomes the way of life

He who trusts the world, the world betrays him

The one, who knows himself, knows his creator

If you love God, tear out your heart's love of the world

The fear of God makes one secure

How can you rejoice this life that grows shorter each hour?

A world wide reputation can be undone by an hour's degradation

Three defects make life miserable; Vindictiveness, Jealousy, A bad character

One who is proud of worldly possessions in this fleeting existence is ignorant

Joy is followed by tears

Each breath of man is a step nearer to death

The best man among us is he who is most helpful to his fellow men

One who thinks himself the best is the worst

The hated person is one who returns evil for good

Virtue is the key to success

Learned men live after death; ignorant men are dead although alive

There is no treasure like knowledge gained

Knowledge is wisdom and educated man is the wise man

Experience is knowledge gained

He who never corrects himself will never correct another

Listen and you will teach yourself: remain silent, and you risk nothing

The one, who reflects on God’s gifts, succeeds

Ignorance harms a man more than a cancer

One of the signs of stupid man is the frequent change of opinion

Never speak when it is not the time for speech

Beware of backbiting it sows the seed of bitterness, and separates you from God and man

The best truth is the keeping of promises

Better be dumb than lie

Do not flatter, it is no sign of faith

A hypocrite's tongue is clean, but there is sickness in his heart.

Better to be alone than with bad company

Who ever sows good, reaps his reward
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 18995

PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some more teachings of Hazarat Ali.

Second Infallible Sayings:

• One who develops the trait of greediness and avarice invites degradation; one who keeps on advertising his poverty and ill-luck will always be humiliated; one who has no control over his tongue will often have to face embarrassment and discomfort.

• When few blessings come your way, do not drive them away through thanklessness.

• Surrender and acceptance to the Will of Allah are the best companions; wisdom is the noblest heritage; theoretical and practical knowledge are the best marks of distinction; deep thinking will present the clearest picture of every problem.

• When this world favors anybody it lends him qualifications, and attributes surpassing merits of others, and when it turns its face away from him it snatches away even his own excellences and fame.

• One who takes account of his shortcomings will always gain by it; one who is unmindful of them will always suffer. One who is afraid of the Day of Judgment is safe from the wrath of Allah; one who takes lessons from the happenings of life obtains vision, one who acquires vision becomes wise, and one who attains wisdom achieves knowledge.

• Treat people in such a way and live amongst them in such a manner that if you die they weep over you, and if you are alive they crave your company.

• If you get an opportunity and power over your enemy, then, in thankfulness to Allah for this: forgive him.

• He is very unfortunate who cannot in his lifetime gain even a few sincere friends and sympathizers and even more unfortunate is the one who has gained them and lost them (through his deeds).

• Failures are often results of timidity and fears; disappointments are the results of uncalled for modesty; hours of leisure pass away like summer clouds, therefore, do not waste the opportunity to do good.

• Whose deeds lower him, his pedigree cannot elevate.

• Be generous but not extravagant, be frugal but not miserly.

• To give up inordinate desires is the best kind of wealth and fortune.

• O son of Adam! When you see that in spite of Allah's constant favors your life is a continuous sin, and then take warning (His Wrath may not turn those very blessings into misfortunes.)

• Often your utterances and the expressions of your face reveal the secrets of your hidden thoughts.

• A wise man first thinks and then speaks, and a fool speaks and then thinks.

• One who is quick in saying unpleasant things about others, will himself quickly become a target to their scandal.

• Happy is the man who always kept the afterlife in his view, who remembers the Day of Reckoning through his deeds, who led a contented life and who was happy with the lot that Allah hath destined for him.

• Adversities often bring your good qualities to the front.

• Success is the result of foresight and resolution, foresight depends upon deep thinking and planning, and the most important factor of planning is to keep your secrets to yourself.

• Hearts of people are like wild birds, they attach themselves to those who love and train them.

• Only he can forgive who has power to punish.

• If you help a deserving person without his request then it is generosity and if you help him after his request then mostly it is due to shyness to your refusal or fear of reproach.

• There is no greater wealth than wisdom, no greater poverty than ignorance, no greater heritage than culture and no greater helpmate than consultation.

• Wealth converts every foreign country into your native place, and poverty turns your native place into a strange land.

• Contentment is the capital which will never come to an end.

• Wealth is the fountainhead of inordinate cravings.

• Whoever warns you against sins and vices is like the one who is carrying news of salvation to you.

• The tongue is such a ferocious beast that if let loose, it will act ravenously.

• People in this world are like travelers whose journey is going on as though they are asleep. (Life's journey is going on though men may not feel it.)

• To lose friends is to become a stranger in one's own country.

• Not to have a thing is less humiliating than to beg it of others.

• Do not be ashamed if the amount of charity is small because to return the needy empty-handed is an act of greater shame.

• If you cannot get things as much as you desire, then be contented with what you have.

• An uneducated man or a savage will always overdo a thing or neglect to do it properly.

• The wiser a man is, the less talkative he will be.

• Every breath you take is a step forward towards death.

• Anything which can be counted or reckoned is finite and will come to an end.

• If you are confused about good or bad effects of an action, then study carefully the cause and you will know what the effects will be.

• The value of each man depends upon the art and skill which he has attained.

• I appreciate an old man's cautious opinion more than the valor of young men.

• How I wonder at a man who loses hope of salvation when the door of repentance is open for him.

• He is the wisest and the most knowing man who advises people not to lose hope and confidence in the Mercy of Allah and not to be too sure and over-confident of immunity from His wrath and punishment.

• Like your body, your mind also gets tired and fagged; in such case find educational diversions for it.

• That knowledge is very superficial which remains only on your tongue; the intrinsic merit and value of knowledge is that you act upon it.

• Whenever a tradition of the holy Prophet (SAW) is related to you, examine it carefully and think over it deeply, do not be satisfied with mere verbatim repetition of the same, because there are many people who repeat the words containing knowledge, but there are few who ponder over them and try to fully grasp the meaning they convey.

• Those who give up religion to better their circumstances in life seldom succeed. The wrath of Allah makes them go through more calamities and losses than the gains they gather for themselves.

• There are many educated people who have ruined their future on account of their ignorance of religion. Their knowledge did not prove of any avail to them.

• Only such a person can establish the Divine Rule, who, where justice and equity are required, will neither feel deficient nor weak and who is not greedy and avaricious.

• When a community is composed of really honest, sober and virtuous people then your forming a bad opinion about any one of its members when nothing wicked has been seen of him is a great injustice to him; on the contrary, in a corrupt society, to form a good opinion of anyone out of those people and to trust him is doing harm to yourself.

• To lose or to waste an opportunity will result in grief and sorrow.

• The world, which offers you vicious pleasures is like a snake, so soft to the touch, but so full of lethal poison. Unwise people are allured by it and drawn towards it and wise men avoid it and keep away from its poisonous effects.

• What difference is there between a deed whose pleasure passes away leaving behind it the pangs of pain and punishment and the deed whose cruel severity or oppressive harshness comes to an end leaving behind it heavenly rewards and blessings.

• Blessings are the man who humbles himself before Allah, whose sources of income are honest, whose intentions are always honorable, whose character is noble, whose habits are sober, who gives away in the name and in the cause of Allah the wealth which is lying surplus with him, who controls his tongue from vicious and useless talk, who abstains from oppression and tyranny, who cheerfully and faithfully follows the traditions of the Holy Prophet (SAW) and who keeps himself away from innovation in religion.

• How I wonder at the mentality of a miser; fearing poverty he takes to stinginess and thus hastily pushes himself head-long into a state of want and destitution; he madly desires plenty and ease but throws it away without understanding. In this world he, of his own free will, leads the life of a beggar and in the next world he will have to submit an account like a millionaire.

• Whoever is not diligent in his work will suffer sorrow and loss; whoever has no share of Allah in his wealth and in his life then there is no place for him in the realm of Allah.

• If you understand the majesty of the Lord then you will not attach any importance to the universe and its marvels.

• An angel announces daily: "The birth of more human beings means so many more will die; the collection of more wealth means so much more will be destroyed; the erection of more buildings means so many more ruins in time to come."

• A friend cannot be considered as a friend unless he is tested on three occasions: in time of need, behind your back, and after your death.

• This world is not a place of permanent settlement, it is a passage, a road on which you are passing; there are two kinds of people here, one is the kinds who have sold their souls to eternal damnation. The other is of those who have purchased their souls and freed them from damnation.

• Daily prayers are the best medium to advance oneself in favor of the Lord. Haj is a Jehad (Holy War) for every weak person. For everything that you own, there is Zakaat, a tax paid to the Lord, and the tax of your health is that you keep fast. The best Jehad of a woman against men is to render his home life-pleasing and congenial.

• If you want to pray to the Lord for better means of subsistence then first give something in charity.

• Sorrow will make you half as decrepit as old age.

• Many persons get nothing out of their fasts but hunger and thirst; many more get nothing out of their night prayers but exertions and sleepless nights. Wise and sagacious persons are praiseworthy even if they do not fast and sleep during the nights.

• Remember that there are three kinds of people, one kind is of those learned people who are highly versed in the ethics of truth and philosophy of religion, second is the kind of those who are acquiring the above knowledge, and the third is that class of people who are uneducated. They follow every pretender and accept every slogan, they have neither acquired any knowledge nor have they secured the support of firm and rational convictions.

• Remember Kumail, Knowledge is better than and superior to wealth because it protects you and you have to guard wealth because wealth decreases if you keep on spending it and knowledge increases the more you make use of it; and because what you get through wealth disappears as soon as wealth disappears.

• A man can be values through his sayings.

• One who does not realize his own value is condemned to utter failure. (Every kind of complex, superiority or inferiority is harmful to man.)

• One who adopts patience will never be deprived of success though the success may take a long time to reach him.

• One who assents or subscribes to the actions of a group or a party is as good as if he has committed the deed himself. A man who joins a sinful deed makes himself responsible for two-fold punishments; one for doing the deed and the other for assenting and subscribing to it.

• One who enters the places of evil reputes has no right to complain against a man who talks evils of him.

• One who guards his secrets has complete control over his affairs.

• Oppression and tyranny are the worst companions for hereafter.

• There is enough light for one who wants to see.

• Often the inordinate desire to secure a single gain acts as a hindrance for the quest of many profitable pursuits.

• People often hate those things which they do not know or cannot understand.

• One who seeks advices learns to recognize mistakes.

• One who fights for the cause of Allah secures victory over his enemies.

• When you feel afraid or nervous to do a thing then do it, because the real harm which you may thus receive is less poignant than its expectation and fear.

• Your supremacy over others is in proportion to the extent of your knowledge and wisdom.

• The best way to punish an evil-doer is to reward handsomely the good deeds of a good person.

• Obstinacy and stubbornness will not allow you to arrive at a correct decision.

• Deficiency will result in shame and sorrow, but caution and foresight will bring peace and security.

• To keep silent when you can say something wise and useful is as bad as to keep on propagating foolish and unwise thoughts.

• If two opposite theories are propagated, one will be wrong.

• One who starts tyranny will repent soon.

• One who cannot benefit by patience will die of grief and excitement.

• If you find that somebody is not grateful for all that you have done for him then do not get disappointed because often you will find that someone else feels under your obligation though you have done nothing for him and thus your good deeds will be compensated, and Allah will reward you for your goodness.

• Hearts (minds) have the tendencies of likes and dislikes, and are liable to be energetic and lethargic, therefore, make them work when they are energetic and on subjects which they like.

• The destitute is the messenger of Allah. Whoever denies him denies Allah and whoever gives him gives Allah.

• Avarice is disgrace; cowardice is a defect; poverty often disables an intelligent man from arguing his case; a poor man is a stranger in his own town; misfortune and helplessness are calamities; patience is a kind of bravery; to sever attachments with the wicked world is the greatest wealth; piety is the best weapon of defense.

• He who is greedy is disgraced; he who discloses his hardship will always be humiliated; he who has no control over his tongue will often have to face discomfort.
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hazrat Ali's Famous Epistle To Malik Ashtar, Governor of Egypt



The Richest Treasure

Be it known to you, O, Malik, that I am sending you as Governor to a country which in the past has experienced both just and unjust rule. Men will scrutinize your actions with a searching eye, even as you used to scrutinize the actions of those before you, and speak of you even as you did speak of them. The fact is that the public speak well of only those who do good. It is they who furnish the proof of your actions. Hence the richest treasure that you may covet would be the treasure of good deeds. Keep your desires under control and deny yourself that which you have been prohibited from, for, by such abstinence alone, you will be able to distinguish between what is good to them and what is not.

Develop in your heart the feeling of love for your people and let it be the source of kindliness and blessing to them. Do not behave with them like a barbarian, and do not appropriate to yourself that which belongs to them. Remember that the citizens of the state are of two categories. They are either your brethren in religion or your brethren in kind. They are subject to infirmities and liable to commit mistakes. Some indeed do commit mistakes. But forgive them even as you would like God to forgive you. Bear in mind that you are placed over them, even as I am placed over you. And then there is God even above him who has given you the position of a Governor in order that you may look after those under you and to be sufficient unto them. And you will be judged by what you do for them.

Do not set yourself against God, for neither do you possess the strength to shield yourself against His displeasure, nor can you place yourself outside the pale of His mercy and forgiveness. Do not feel sorry over any act of forgiveness, nor rejoice over any punishment that you may mete out to any one. Do not rouse yourself to anger, for no good will come out of it.

Do not say: " I am your overlord and dictator, and that you should, therefore, bow to my commands", as that will corrupt your heart, weaken your faith in religion and create disorder in the state. Should you be elated by power, ever feel in your mind the slightest symptoms of pride and arrogance, then look at the power and majesty of the Divine governance of the Universe over which you have absolutely no control. It will restore the sense of balance to your wayward intelligence and give you the sense of calmness and affability. Beware! Never put yourself against the majesty and grandeur of God and never imitate His omnipotence; for God has brought low every rebel of God and every tyrant of man.

Let your mind respect through your actions the rights of God and the rights of man, and likewise, persuade your companions and relations to do likewise. For, otherwise, you will be doing injustice to yourself and injustice to humanity. Thus both man and God will turn unto your enemies. There is no hearing anywhere for one who makes an enemy of God himself. He will be regarded as one at war with God until he feels contrition and seeks forgiveness. Nothing deprives man of divine blessings or excites divine wrath against him more easily than cruelty. Hence it is, that God listens to the voice of the oppressed and waylays the oppressor.

The Common Man

Maintain justice in administration and impose it on your own self and seek the consent of the people, for, the discontent of the masses sterilizes the contentment of the privileged few and the discontent of the few looses itself in the contentment of the many. Remember the privileged few will not rally round you in moments of difficulty: they will try to side-track justice, they will ask for more than what they deserve and will show no gratitude for favours done to them. They will feel restive in the face of trials and will offer no regret for their shortcomings. It is the common man who is the strength of the State and Religion. It is he who fights the enemy. So live in close contact with the masses and be mindful of their welfare.

Keep at a distance him who peers into the weaknesses of others. After all, the masses are not free from weaknesses. It is the duty of the ruler to shield them. Do not bring to light that which is hidden, but try to remove those weaknesses which have been brought to light. God is watchful of everything that is hidden from you, and He alone will deal with it. To the best of your ability cover the weaknesses of the public, and God will cover the weaknesses in you which you are anxious to keep away from their eye. Unloose the tangle of mutual hatred between the public and the administration and remove all those causes which may give rise to strained relations between them. Protect yourself from every such act as may not be quite correct for you. Do not make haste in seeking confirmation of tale-telling, for, the tale-teller is a deceitful person appearing in the garb of a friend.

The Counsellors

Never take counsel of a miser, for he will vitiate your magnanimity and frighten you of poverty. Do not take counsel of a coward also, for, he will cheat you of your resolves. Do not take counsel of the greedy too: for he will instil greed in you and turn you into a tyrant. Miserliness, cowardice and greed deprive man of his trust in God.

The worst of counsellors is he who has served as a counsellor to unjust rulers and shared their crimes. So, never let men who have been companions of tyrants or shared their crimes be your counsellors. You can get better men than these, men gifted with intelligence and foresight, but unpolluted by sin, men who have never aided a tyrant in his tyranny or a criminal in his crime. Such men will never be a burden on you. On the other hand, they will be a source of help and strength to you at all times. They will be friends to you and strangers to your enemies. Choose such men alone for companionship both in privacy and in the public. Even among these, show preference to them who have a habitual regard for truth however trying to you at times their truth may prove to be, and who offer you no encouragement in the display of tendencies which God does not like his friends to develop.

Keep close to you the upright, and the God fearing, and make clear to them that they are never to flatter you and never to give you credit for any good that you may not have done: for, the tolerance of flattery and unhealthy praise stimulates pride in man makes him arrogant.

Do not treat the good and the bad alike. That will deter the good from doing good, and encourage the bad in their bad pursuits. Recompense every one according one's deserts. Remember that mutual trust and good will between the ruler and the ruled are bred only through benevolence, justice and service. So, cultivate good-will amongst the people; for their good-will alone will save you from troubles. Your benevolence to them will be repaid by their trust in you, and your ill-treatment by their ill-will.

Do not disregard the noble traditions set by our forbearers which have promoted harmony and progress among the people; and do not initiate anything which might minimize their usefulness. The men who had established these noble traditions have had their reward; but responsibility will be yours if they are disturbed. Try always to learn something from the experience of the learned and the wise, and frequently consult them in state matters so that you might maintain the peace and good-will which your predecessors had established in the land.

The Different Classes of People

Remember that the people are composed of different classes. The progress of one is dependent on the progress of every other; and none can afford to be independent of the other. We have the Army formed of the soldiers of God, we have our civil officers and their establishments, our judiciary, our revenue collectors and our public relation officers. The general public itself consists of Muslims and Zimmis and among them of merchants and craftsmen, the unemployed and the indigent. God has prescribed for them their several rights, duties and obligations. They are all defined and preserved in the Book of God and in the traditions of his Prophet.

The army, by the grace of God, is like a fortress to the people and lends dignity to the state. It upholds the prestige of the Faith and maintains the peace of the country. Without it the state cannot stand. In its turn, it cannot stand without the support of the state. Our soldiers have proved strong before the enemy because of the privilege God has given them to fight for Him; but they have their material needs to fulfil and have therefore to depend upon the income provided for them from the state revenue. The military and civil population who pay revenue, both need the co-operation of others -the judiciary, civil officers and their establishment. The Qazi administers civil and criminal law; the civil officers collect revenue and attend to civil administration with the assistance of their establishment. And then there are the tradesmen and the merchants who add to the revenue of the state. It is they who run the markets and are in a better position than others to discharge social obligations. And then there is the class of the poor and the needy, whose maintenance is an obligation on the other classes. God has given appropriate opportunity of service to one and all; and then there are the rights of all these classes over the administration which the administrator has to meet with an eye on the good of the entire population, a duty which he cannot fulfil properly unless he takes personal interest in its execution and seeks help from God. Indeed it is obligatory on him to impose this duty on himself and to bear with patience the inconveniences and difficulties incidental to his task.

The Army

Be particularly mindful of the welfare of those in the army who in your opinion, are staunchly faithful to their God and Prophet and loyal to their chief, and who in the hour of passion can restrain themselves and listen coolly to sensible remonstrance, and who can succour the weak and smite the strong, whom violent provocation will not throw into violent temper and who will not falter at any stage.

Keep yourself in close contact with the families of established reputation and integrity with a glorious past, and draw to yourself men brave and upright in character, generous and benevolent in disposition; for such are the salt of society.

Care for them with the tenderness with which you care for your children, and do not talk before them of any good that you might have done to them, nor disregard any expression of affection which they show in return; for, such conduct inspires loyalty, devotion and goodwill. Attend to every little of their wants not resting content with what general help that you might have given to them, for sometimes, timely attention to a little want of theirs brings them immense relief. Surely these people will not forget you in your own hour of need.

It behoves you to select for your Commander-in-chief one who imposes on himself as a duty, the task of rendering help to his men, and who can excel in kindness every other officer who has to attend to the needs of the men under him, and look after their families when they are away from their homes; so much so, that the entire army should feel united in their joys and in their sorrows. The unity of purpose will give them added strength against the enemy. Continue to maintain a kindly attitude towards them so that they might feel attached to you. The fact is that the real happiness of the administrators and their most pleasant comfort lies in establishing justice in the state and maintaining affectionate relations with the people. Their sincerity of feeling is expressed in the love and regard they show to you, on which alone depends the safety of the administrators.

Your advices to the army will be of no avail, unless and until you show affection to both men and officers, in order that they might not regard the Government as an oppressive burden or contribute to its downfall.

Continue to satisfy their needs and praise them over and over again for what services they have rendered. Such an attitude, God willing will inspire the brave to braver actions and induce the timid to deeds of bravery.

Try to enter into the feelings of others and do not foist the mistake of one over another and do not grudge dispensing appropriate rewards. See to it you do not show favours to one who has done nothing but merely counts on his family position; and do not withhold proper rewards from one who has done great deeds simply because he holds a low position in life.

The Real Guidance

Turn to God and to His prophet for guidance whenever you feel uncertain as to what you have to do. There is the commandment of God delivered to those people who He wishes to guide aright: "O people of the Faith! Obey God and obey His prophet and those from among you who hold authority over you. And refer to God and His prophet whenever there is difference of opinion among you. To turn to God is in reality to consult the Book of God; and to turn to the prophet is t follow his universally accepted traditions.

Chief Judge

Select for your chief judge one from the people who is by far the best among them -one who is not obsessed with domestic worries, one who cannot be intimidated, one who does not err to often, one who does not turn back from a right path once he finds it, one who is not self-centred or avaricious, one who will not decide before knowing full facts, one who will weigh wit care every attendant doubt and pronounce a clear verdict after taking everything into full consideration, one who will not grow restive over the arguments of advocates and who will examine with patience every new disclosure of fact and who will be strictly impartial in his decision, one who flattery cannot mislead or one who does not exult over his position. But it is not easy to find such men.

Once you have selected the right man for the office, pay him handsomely enough, to let him live in comfort and in keeping with his position, enough to keep him above temptations. Give him a position in your court so high none can even dream of coveting it and so high that neither back-biting nor intrigue can touch him.

Subordinate Judiciary

Beware! The utmost carefulness is to be exercised in his selection: for it is this high office which adventurous self-seekers aspire to secure and exploit in their selfish interests. After the selection of your chief judge, give careful consideration to the selection of other officers. Confirm them in their appointments after approved apprenticeship and probation. Never select men for responsible posts either out of any regard for personal connections or under any influence, for, that might lead to injustice and corruption.

Of these select for higher posts men of experience, men firm in faith and belonging to good families. Such men will not fall an easy prey to temptations and will discharge their duties with an eye on the abiding good of others. Increase their salaries to give them a contented life. A contented living is a help to self-purification. They will not feel the urge to tax the earnings of their subordinates for their own upkeep. They will then have no excuse either to go against your instructions or misappropriate state funds. Keep to watch over them without their knowledge, loyal and upright men. Perchance they may develop true honesty and true concern for the public welfare. But whenever any of them is accused of dishonesty and the guilt is confirmed by the report of your secret service, then regard this as a sufficient to convict him. Let the punishment be corporal and let that be dealt in the public at an appointed place of degradation.

Revenue Administration

Great care is to be exercised in revenue administration, to ensure the prosperity of those who pay the revenue to the state; for it is on their prosperity depends the prosperity of others, particularly the prosperity of the masses. Indeed, the state exists on its revenue. You should regard the proper upkeep of the land in cultivation as of greater importance than the collection of revenue, for revenue cannot be derived except by making the land productive. He who demands revenue without helping the cultivator to improve his land, inflicts unmerited hardship on the cultivator and ruins the State. The rule of such a person does not last long. If the cultivators ask for reduction of their land cess for having suffered from epidemics or drought or excess of rains or the barrenness of the soil or floods damaging to their barrenness of the soil or foods damaging to their crops, then, reduce the cess accordingly, so that their condition might improve. Do not mind the loss of revenue on that account for that will return to you one day manifold in the hour of greater prosperity of the land and enable you to improve the condition of your towns and to raise the prestige of your state. You will be the object of universal praise. The people will believe in your sense of justice. The confidence which they will place in you in consequence will prove your strength, as they will be found ready to share your burdens.

You may settle down on the land any number of people, but discontent will overtake them if the land is not improved. The cause of the cultivator's ruin is the rulers who are bent feverishly on accumulating wealth at all costs, out of the fear that their rule might not last long. Such are the people who do not learn from examples or precedents.

Clerical Establishment

Keep an eye on your establishment and your scribes; and select the best among them for your confidential correspondence such among these as possess high character and deserve your full confidence, men who may not exploit their privileged position to go against you and who may not grow neglectful of their duties and who in the drafting of treaties may not succumb to external temptation and harm your interests, or fail to render you proper assistance and to save you from trouble, and who in carrying out their duties can realize their serious responsibilities, for he who does not realize his own responsibilities can hardly appraise the reprehensibility of others. Do not select men for such work merely on the strength of your first impressions of your affection or good faith; for as a matter of fact; the pretensions of a good many who are really devoid of honesty and good breeding may cheat even the intelligence of rulers. Selection should be made after due probation which should be the test of righteousness. In making direct appointments from people, see to it that those selected possess influence with the people and who enjoy the reputation of being honest; for such selection is agreeable to God and the ruler. For every department of administration, let there be a head, whom no trying task might cause worry and no pressure of work annoy.

And remember that every weakness of any one among your establishment and scribe which you may overlook will be written down against you in your scroll of deeds
.
Trade and Industry

Adopt useful schemes placed before those engaged in trade and industry and help them with wise counsels. Some of them live in towns, and some move from place to place with their wares and tools and earn their living by manual labour. Trade and Industry are sources of profit to the State. While the general public is not inclined to bear the strain, those engaged in these professions take the trouble to collect commodities from far and near, from land and from across the sea, and from mountains and forests and naturally derive benefits.

It is this class of peace loving people from whom no disturbance need be feared. They love peace and order; indeed they are incapable of creating disorder. Visit every part of the country and establish personal contact with this class, and inquire into their condition. But bear in mind that a good many of them are intensely greedy and are inured to bad dealings. They hoard grain and try to sell it at a high price; and this is most harmful to the public. It is a blot on the name of the ruler not to fight this evil. Prevent them from hoarding; for the Prophet of God -Peace be upon him - had prohibited it. And see to it that trade is carried on with the utmost ease, that the scales are evenly held and that prices are so fixed that neither the seller nor the buyer is put to a loss. And if inspite of your warning, should anyone go against your commands and commit the crime of hoarding, then deal him appropriately with severe punishment.

The Poor

Beware! Fear God when dealing with the problem of the poor who have non to patronize, who are forlorn, indigent and helpless and are greatly torn in mind -victims of the vicissitudes of Time. Among them there are some who do not question their lot in life not withstanding their misery, do not go about begging. For God's sake, safeguard their rights; for on you rests the responsibility of protection. Assign for their uplift a portion of the state exchequer (Baitul-mal), wherever they may be, whether close at hand or far away from you. The rights of the two should be equal in your eye. Do not let any preoccupation slip them from your mind; for no excuse whatsoever for the disregard of their rights will be acceptable to God. Do not treat their interests as of less importance than your own, and never keep them outside the purview of your important considerations, and mark the persons who look down upon them and of whose conditions they keep you in ignorance.

Select from among your officers such men as are meek and God fearing who can keep you properly informed of the condition of the poor. Make such provision for these poor people as shall not oblige you to offer an excuse before God on the day of judgment; for, it is this section of the people more than any other which deserves benevolent treatment. Seek your reward from God by giving to each of them what is due to him and enjoin on yourself as a sacred duty the task of meting the needs of such aged among them as have no independent means of livelihood and are averse to seek alms. And it is the discharge of this duty that usually proves very trying for ruler, but is very welcome to societies which are gifted with foresight. It is only such societies or nations who truly carry out with equanimity their covenant with God to discharge their duty to the poor.

Open Conferences

Meet the oppressed and the lowly periodically in an open conference and, conscious of the divine presence there, have a heart-to-heart talk with them, and let none from your armed guard or civil officers or members of the police or the Intelligence Department be by your side, so that the representatives of the poor might state their grievances fearlessly and without reserve. For I have the Prophet of God saying that no nation or society will occupy a high position in which the strong do not discharge their duty to the weak. Bear with composure any strong language which they may use, and do not get annoyed if they cannot state their case lucidly, even so, God will open you his door of blessings and rewards. Whatever you can give to them, give it ungrudgingly, and whatever you cannot afford to give, make that clear to them in utmost sincerity.

There are certain things which call for prompt action. Accept the recommendations made by your officers for the redress of the grievances of the clerical staff. See to it that petitions or applications that are submitted for your consideration, are brought to your notice the very day they are submitted, however much your officers might try to intercede them. Dispose off the day's work that very day, for the coming day will bring with it its own tasks.

Communion with God

And do not forget to set apart the best of your time for communion with God, although every moment of yours is for Him only, provided it is spend sincerely in the service of your people. The special time that you give to prayer in the strict religious sense is to be devoted to the performances of the prescribed daily prayers. Keep yourself engaged in these prayers both in the day and in the night, and to gain perfect communion, do not as far as possible, let your prayers grow tiresome. And when you lead in congregational prayer, do not let your prayer be so lengthy as to cause discomfort to the congregation or raise in them the feeling of dislike for it or liquidate its effect: for in the congregation there may be invalids and also those who have to attend pressing affairs of their own.

When I had asked of the Prophet of God on receiving an order to proceed to Yaman, how I should lead the people there in prayer, he said -perform your prayers even as the weakest among you would do; and set an example of consideration to the faithful.

Aloofness not desirable

Alongside of the observance of all that I have said above bear one thing in mind. Never for any length of time keep yourself aloof from the people, for to do so is to keep oneself ignorant of their affairs. It develops in the ruler a wrong perspective and renders him unable to distinguish between what is important and what is not, between right and wrong, and between truth and falsehood. The ruler is after all human; and he cannot form a correct view of anything which is out of sight. There is no distinctive sign attached to truth which may enable one to distinguish between the different varieties of truth and falsehood. The fact is that you must be one of two things. Either you are just or unjust. If you are just, then you will not keep yourself away from the people, but will listen to them and meet their requirements. On the other hand, it you are unjust, the people themselves will keep way from you. What virtue is there in your keeping aloof? At all events aloofness is not desirable especially when it is your duty to attend to the needs of the people. Complaints of oppression by your officers or petitions for justice should not prove irksome to you.

Make this clear to yourself that those immediately about and around you will like to exploit their position to covet what belongs to others and commit acts of injustice. Suppress such a tendency in them. Make a rule of your conduct never to give even a small piece of land to any of your relations. That will prevent them from causing harm to the interests of others and save you from courting the disapprobation of God and Man.

Deal justice squarely regardless of the fact whether one is a relation or not. If any of your relations or companions violates the law, mete out the punishment prescribed by law however painful it might be to you personally; for it will be all to the good of the State. If at any time people suspect, that you have been unjust to them in any respect disclose your mind to them and remove their suspicions. In this way, your mind will get attuned to the sense of justice and people will begin to love you. It will also fulfil your wish that you should enjoy their confidence.

Peace And Treaties

Bear in mind that you do not throw away the offer of peace which your enemy may himself make. Accept it, for, that will please God. Peace is a source of comfort to the army; it reduces your worries and promotes order in the State. But Beware! Be on your guard when the peace is signed; for, certain types of enemies propose terms of peace just to lull you into a sense of security only to attack you again when you are off your guard. So you should exercise the utmost vigilance on your part, and place no undue faith in their protestations. But, if under the peace treaty you have accepted any obligations, discharge those obligations scrupulously. It is a trust and must be faithfully upheld and whenever you have promised anything, keep it with all the strength that you command, for whatever differences of opinion might exist on other matters, there is nothing so noble as the fulfilment of a promise. This is recognized even among non-Muslims, for they know the dire consequences which follow from the breaking of covenants. So never make excuses in discharging your responsibilities and never break a promise, nor cheat your enemy. For, breach of promise is an act against God, and none except the positively wicked acts against God

Indeed divine promises are a blessing spread over all mankind. The promise of God is a refuge sought after even by the most powerful on earth; for there is no risk of being cheated. So, do not make any promise from which you may afterwards offer excuses to retract; nor do you go back upon what you have confirmed to abide by; nor do you break it, however galling it may at first prove to be. For, it is far better to wait in patience for wholesome results to follow than to break it out of any apprehensions.

Beware! Abstain from shedding blood without a valid cause. There is nothing more harmful than this which brings about one's ruin. The blood that is wilfully shed shortens the life of a state. On the day of judgment it is this crime for which one will have to answer first. So, beware! Do not wish to build the strength of your state on blood; for, it is this blood which ultimately weakens the state and passes it on to other hands. Before me and my God no excuse for wilful killing can be entertained.

Murder is a crime which is punishable by death. If on any accord the corporal punishment dealt by the state for any lesser crime results in the death of the guilty, let not the prestige of the stage stand in any way of the deceased relations claiming blood money.

Last Instructions

Do not make haste to do a thing before its time, nor put it off when the right moment arrives. Do not insist on doing a wrong thing, nor show slackness in rectifying a wrong thing. Perform everything in its proper time, and let everything occupy its proper place. When the people as a whole agree upon a thing, do not impose your own view on them and do not neglect to discharge the responsibility that rests on you in consequence. For, the eyes of the people will be on you and you are answerable for whatever you do to them. The slightest dereliction of duty will bring its own retribution. Keep your anger under control and keep your hands and tongue in check Whenever you fall into anger, try to restrain yourself or else you will simply increase your worries.

It is imperative on you to study carefully the principles which have inspired just and good rulers who have gone before you. Give close thought to the example of our prophet (peace be upon him), his traditions , and the commandments of the Book of God and whatever you might have assimilated from my own way of dealing with things. Endeavour to the best of your ability to carry out the instructions which I have given you here and which you have solemnly undertaken to follow. By means of this order, I enjoin on you not to succumb to the prompting of your own heart or to turn away from the discharge of duties entrusted to you.

I seek the refuge of the might of the Almighty and of His limitless sphere of blessings, and invite you to pray with me that He may give us together the grace willingly to surrender our will to His will, and to enable us to acquit ourselves before Him and His creation; so that mankind might cherish our memory and our work survive. I seek of God the culmination of his blessings and pray that He may grant you and me His grace and the honour of martyrdom in His cause. Verily, we have to return to Him. I invoke His blessings on the Prophet of God and his pure progeny.
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Seeker



Joined: 01 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2005 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You write:

"The Real Guidance
Turn to God and to His prophet for guidance whenever you feel uncertain as to what you have to do. There is the commandment of God delivered to those people who He wishes to guide aright: "O people of the Faith! Obey God and obey His prophet and those from among you who hold authority over you. And refer to God and His prophet whenever there is difference of opinion among you. To turn to God is in reality to consult the Book of God; and to turn to the prophet is t follow his universally accepted traditions."


What source is this from? Looks like Hazrat Ali himself is saying what mainstream interpretations say (following sunnah etc.)! Consulting the Book and following prophet's traditions would make me...what?


Where are our Ismaili sources of what Hazrat Ali said?


In the above quote, the interpretation that Hazrat Ali is giving to the verse"those from among you who hold authority over you" seems quite general, more or less the way sunni interpretations claim (not even in isna ashari). Is Hazrat Ali agreeing with that in principle? Shias give this line a very specific meaning, and derive the idea of hereditary Imams partly from this line. Are we wrong to use this line in our specific interpretation that it refers only to hereditary Imams?


Where can I find more on Hazrat Ali's authentic sayings. Also, where can I find the book that Isna Ashari's use in Iran. Does anyone know?
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nagib



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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2005 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="Seeker"]You write:
Where are our Ismaili sources of what Hazrat Ali said? quote]

Books like Nahjul Bhalaga and others on Hazrat Ali's sayings should not be considered accurate as they are not always.

Our sources should be the Farmans of the Imam of the Time. If Hazar Imam says Hazrat Ali has said this or that, it would confirm the authenticity of the saying. Like Aga Ali shah, Aga Hasanali Shah, Sultan Mohamed Shah and Hazar Imam have quoted hadiths, these should be considered authentic but to consider all existing hadith as authentic would be a mistake that none of our Sunni and Shia Muslim brothers would ever do.

When the memois were published, Mowlana Sultan Muhammad Shah sent a Talika explaining that he has 2 audiences, one was Ismaili and the other was non-Ismailis and his Memoirs were a public document that was written for his other audience, not for Ismailis. This Talika was read in JKs all ver the world. Ask your Grandfather, he may remember this Talika. I have read this Talika but was not able to make a copy unfortunately.

One example, Aga Ali Shah mentionned the hadith about 72+1 sects in Islam after the death of the Prophet [PBUH], Hazar Imam also had mentionned the same in October 2000 in Karachi [unfortunately our people censured that one and it is not read in JK]. So we should consider that particular hadith as true. I hope you get he principle...

Nagib
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curious2



Joined: 05 May 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2005 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nagib wrote:
Hazar Imam also had mentionned the same in October 2000 in Karachi [unfortunately our people censured that one and it is not read in JK]. So we should consider that particular hadith as true. I hope you get he principle...

Nagib


Can you tell me more about this? If you don't mind send me PM if the topic is too sensitive. Thanks a bunch.
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Ali77



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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:28 am    Post subject: Re: Kalame Mowla Reply with quote

nagib wrote:
Kalame Mowla is a work which only claims to be translation into Hindi of sayings of Imam Ali. Some verses are recited when there is death because some verses of this work talk of this subject. Sometime it is recited on Thursday night or for Mowla jo Rojo but those days, Chogadias should be recitenagib

Nagib or any one els would like to tell me if Kalam e mola is not written by Hazrat Ali why it is teated like that and if it is translation who translate it ? why dont we directly read the sayings of ali which are available in different collections? should we read such material which authenticity is ambiguous? Is there any historical proff that it is translated by any pir ?Is there any farman about karam e mola??
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Admin



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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kalame Mowla is written by Pir Shams who has translated the sayings of Imam Ali, so says one of the oldest, if not the oldest, manuscript available today. The manuscript in the collection of the Heritage Web Site starts with the words, <Pir Shams Kahe Suno Bay, Mowla ka kalam ka bhayan jo hindi bol sunaya>.

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mabus



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PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2007 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya Ali Madad!

Is there any other detailed history on Qalam-e-Mowla? I mean, outside of the Imam (AS), how is its authenticity proven? Does it have any parallel narrations with Najul'Balagha, perhaps? Also, doesn't it mention an Indian king in it?
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prince_visram



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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2009 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am looking for Kalame Mowla verses reffering to either death or about mothers. I have a varo tonight and someone just past away. I have a book so you can even just post the number of the selected verses. Any help would be greatly appriciated. Thanks,

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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2009 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mabus wrote:
Ya Ali Madad!

Is there any other detailed history on Qalam-e-Mowla? I mean, outside of the Imam (AS), how is its authenticity proven? Does it have any parallel narrations with Najul'Balagha, perhaps? Also, doesn't it mention an Indian king in it?


We have the entire Kalame Mowla transliterated and translated at:

http://ismaili.net/ginans/Qalamemowla2/qalamindex.html

Search for the words mother and death in the pages.


Last edited by kmaherali on Wed May 20, 2009 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total
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prince_visram



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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2009 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmaherali wrote:
mabus wrote:
Ya Ali Madad!

Is there any other detailed history on Qalam-e-Mowla? I mean, outside of the Imam (AS), how is its authenticity proven? Does it have any parallel narrations with Najul'Balagha, perhaps? Also, doesn't it mention an Indian king in it?


We have entire Kalame Mowla transliterated and translated at:

http://ismaili.net/ginans/Qalamemowla2/qalamindex.html

Search for the words mother and death in the pages.


YAY! Thank you soooooo much! I love your support kmaherali! You are truly wonderful and I am sure you will get benifits from the amazing seva and information you are providing. Great controbution, I would also like to thank all the members that are on-top-of the questions... and the Admins! Thank you all!!
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agakhani



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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 3:43 am    Post subject: But who wrote the KALAME MOWLA? Reply with quote

Good to know all informations, very knowledgable, but my question remain the same, who wrote the "KALAME MOWLA" in Hindi (or whatever language you call, not the Urdu because Urdu was not exist that time) Pir Shams? or who? If pir Shams than he was born more than 900 years ago, my question is this: was Hindi language exist at Pir Sham's time 900 years ago? I think Sanskrit language had monopoly at that time since as per my study most Indian poems, scripture, history and ston inscriptions has been written in Sanskrit language.
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ShamsB



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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 7:45 am    Post subject: Re: But who wrote the KALAME MOWLA? Reply with quote

agakhani wrote:
Good to know all informations, very knowledgable, but my question remain the same, who wrote the "KALAME MOWLA" in Hindi (or whatever language you call, not the Urdu because Urdu was not exist that time) Pir Shams? or who? If pir Shams than he was born more than 900 years ago, my question is this: was Hindi language exist at Pir Sham's time 900 years ago? I think Sanskrit language had monopoly at that time since as per my study most Indian poems, scripture, history and ston inscriptions has been written in Sanskrit language.



Have you studied the ginans of pir shams?

Pir Nachi ne Kaathe Ginan Re ma?

Shams
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agakhani



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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 3:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is this your answer brother Shams? yes I read and listened this Garabi too many times the Garabi look like written in Gujarati language but my question was about existence of Hindi language during Pir Shams era and second question was who wrote the KALAME MOWLA in Hindi ? Which Pirs?
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TheMaw



Joined: 14 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

agakhani wrote:
Is this your answer brother Shams? yes I read and listened this Garabi too many times the Garabi look like written in Gujarati language but my question was about existence of Hindi language during Pir Shams era and second question was who wrote the KALAME MOWLA in Hindi ? Which Pirs?
Pir Sadradin was born about 700 AH. At that time, the ancestor of Hindi-Urdu was in its formative stages, having been formalised after the conquest of the Punjab about two centuries earlier and subsequent movement east with the conquest of Delhi in 693 AH.

Whatever was written in that time would not have been written down, but remembered. As it was written down later, so would it have been written in the most current form of the language.

I don't know who wrote the Kalam-e Mowla.
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kmaherali



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Islam’s Great Striver: Hazrat Ali

http://simerg.com/literary-readings/islams-great-striver-hazrat-ali/
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 4:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

agakhani wrote:
Is this your answer brother Shams? yes I read and listened this Garabi too many times the Garabi look like written in Gujarati language but my question was about existence of Hindi language during Pir Shams era and second question was who wrote the KALAME MOWLA in Hindi ? Which Pirs?


I believe the Heritage Society has the oldest Manuscript available of kalame Mowla and in it the author is said to be Pir Shams. In fact the first words are "Pir Shams kahe suno Mowla ka Kalam ka bayan..."
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agakhani



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I believe the Heritage Society has the oldest Manuscript available of kalame Mowla and in it the author is said to be Pir Shams. In fact the first words are "Pir Shams kahe suno Mowla ka Kalam ka bayan..."


Thanks for information, it means that during the time of Pir Shams, Hindi language was existed along with Gujarati language, while Urdu language was started during the time of Mughal empires so it was not existed during time of Pir shams (s.a.)
One study show that Urdu language is not old more than 350 years, while Pir Shams was born around 900 years ago.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 14, 2011 1:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It may have been that language has evolved...
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agakhani



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Urdu language has been made taking and adopting some words from different languages like Hindi, Persian, Arabic, Punjabi, Gujarati and many other Indians subcontinent languages which were existed during Moghul empires.
It was first started among Mughal Army to keep secret of their attack plans from the enemies, but it spread rapidly and became more and more popular so that Mughal empires and many Muslim accepted as their mother tongue.
Urdu language is 'KHICHADA LANGUAGE' of many languages but it is very sweet and philosophical language specially in ghazal, sher- Shayari and kavvalis. It became more famous in 'NAWABS" era for "GHAZAL and MUJARA" and giving respects to each others.
You probably heard a story 'PEHLE AAP, PEHLE AAP, NAHI PEHLE AAP between two Nawabs, who missed the train in giving respect to each other who enter first in train but doing this they both missed the train!!.
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star_munir



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hindi and Urdu language was there during times of Pir Shams. Hindi is very old language. Urdu language was developed during Mughal time (but was originated before that) during the time of Delhi Sultanate. Though it became popular among masses much later.
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star_munir



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or otherwise it could have been translated by the devotees as W. Ivanow opined (just like in current times Farmans are translated in different languages).
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agakhani



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2012 5:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Urdu language was developed during Mughal time (but was originated before that)


Thnaks Munir for your inputs, I agree that Hindi language was there during the time of Pir shams but not the Urdu language, as a residence of Pakistan I think you should know better than us about the history of Urdu language, it is historically proven that Urdu language is not more than 350-400 years old so basically Urdu language was not exist during pir Shams.
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star_munir



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2012 11:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

May be Pir Shams had composed the Ginan in Hindi language or otherwise it would have been translated later on by the devotees. However, I think Urdu language had started originating and evolving even before Pir Shams. This is because, if you will see historical background of Urdu, it emerged during Delhi Sultanate. When Ghori invaded India and formed permanent basis for the Muslim rule in Delhi, at that time Persian was the cultural and literary language of the rulers whereas Arabic was considered as religious language. However, in the royal courts, there were Turks, Arabs, Afghans, Local Indian (who spoke different languages including Brij Bhasha, Prakrit etc). Thus with the contact of so many people at one place (royal court) speaking different languages give rise to the new language which later came to be known as Urdu. However throughout the history, Urdu was called by different names such as Hindustani language, Dehalvi language etc
Urdu started originating that early..though it developed more in Mughal court and during later Mughal period it became very popular. Urdu evolved throughout the course of history and so was Hindi.
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agakhani



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2012 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Munir,
Good to know about more detail on history of Urdu language, I would still like to add few my own thoghts as well, first of all let me confess that Urdu is a very sweet language and it is a language of respects, it is a language of poetry and knowledge. Many valuable Islamic literature has been translated in Urdu language because Urdu and Persian language has same alphabets and many same words, Urdu language is a golden treasures for non- Arabic and non- persian readers as long as Islamic literature are concerned. I noticed that many Arabic literature also translated in Urdu language for example Ibn Hisham, Muhammad ibn Jarir al-Tabari. Shibli Nomani and many Islamic scholars literatures are translated and available in Urdu but these translation is not made in other languages not even in English language yet.

Quote:
The language of the Muslims of Central and Southern Asia was Persian for the time between 1000 CE and 1700 CE. It was the language of the government, literature, and education. After the 1700’s, Urdu emerged as the dominating force replacing Persian gradually
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agakhani



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 5:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
There is at least one manuscript written in the 1800s' which claims that Pir Shams is the author of Kalame Mowla.


Quote:
Kalame Mowla is written by Pir Shams who has translated the sayings of Imam Ali,


I didn't agreed on above answers so I argued below:-

Code:
but my question remain the same, who wrote the "KALAME MOWLA" in Hindi (or whatever language you call, not the Urdu because Urdu was not exist that time) Pir Shams? or who? If pir Shams than he was born more than 900 years ago, my question is this: was Hindi language exist at Pir Sham's time 900 years ago? I think Sanskrit language had monopoly at that time since as per my study most Indian poems, scripture, history and ston inscriptions has been written in Sanskrit language.


Munir,

Thanks you rejuvenate this older post and believe me may be to find out the correct answer who wrote the Kalame Mowla? yesterday I just started to listen one old waez of Rai Dr. Abu Ali in my car, the detail is below:-

Waez # 173
Waez delivered date 9 August, 1987
Place: Elodea, Ontario
Title of Waez:- Dunia ghar Matamka.
Subject:- Kalame Mowla.

In this waez Rai saheb mentioned the history of Kalme Molwa, according him it was first composed some where after year 1800 by a grand son of Imam Hasan Ali Shah (s.a.) his name was Aga Shamsudiin ( not Pir Shams as wrote above) Aga Shamsuddin also wrote a famous Munajat 'ya ali Khub Mijalis Jinnat Karke Faras bichhayi Gali " also in Hindi language.
That prove that Pir Shams didn't composed "KALAME MOWLA" because that time Hindi language was not so popular but Aga Shamsuddin ( may be called pir Shams) composed 'Kalame Mowla' which is backing my arguments and questions above, please read my arguments in green coded color above.
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star_munir



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for this information and reference icon_smile.gif This matter is now clarified

Some times because of similar names such errors occur. For example one of the scholar Tazim Kassam in her well known book "Songs of wisdom and circle of dances" has included ginan "Navroj na din sohamna" among the ginans of Pir Shams. May be the word "bhare syed Shamsi" would have led to presume it as ginan of Pir Shams. Actually that ginan was composed by Syed Fateh Ali (his name is also there in ginan) at the time of Imam Khalilullah.

One thing I would like to add Sanskrit was not having monopoly as religious language at the time of Pir Shams. That was time when bhakti movement was on its peak. The preachers of bhakti movement preferred using local languages like Punjabi, Bengali, Gujarati etc instead of Sanskrit. One of the preacher of bhakti movement was "Kabirdas" who was living during the time of Sikandar Lodhi (and his name also appears in Brahm Prakash). He had said "Sanskrit is like the water in a well. The language of people is like the flowing stream"
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