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www.ismaili.net :: View topic - Hejab
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Hejab
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elham



Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2006 9:04 am    Post subject: Hejab Reply with quote

hello every body.<BR>One thing that i m considering is hejab . When i see other muslims around the world and my self as a ismaili some times i happen to ask myself why our wemon do not have hejab . just when i am reading quran and read some verses about this matter i get confused .Can u help?
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 14382

PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2006 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There has been discussion on this issue in this forum at:

Inspiration --> Hijab - A Poem

You may want to go there. You will find allusions to the Imams' messages on this subject.
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farida



Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 40

PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2006 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya Ali Madad

Sometime in the 1950's, Mowlana Sultan Mohammed Shah made a farman that the women should dress in western style clothing. i do not have this farman to hand but it was after this that my mother, with other Ismaili ladies, started wearing short dresses. Before this time they used to wear long dresses with a shall or saris in East Africa.

you may try asking an elderly relation in your family for more information about the above but something for you to think about:

At the end of the day we are Shia ismailis with Hazar Imam to guide us; not sunni Muslims.

farida
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razinizar



Joined: 24 May 2005
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
hello every body.<BR>One thing that i m considering is hejab . When i see other muslims around the world and my self as a ismaili some times i happen to ask myself why our wemon do not have hejab . just when i am reading quran and read some verses about this matter i get confused .Can u help?


You Should Dress According to the Culture.. I said it Before and i m saying it again that Allah has given us "the intellect" to decide what is right and what is wrong .. u should use ur mind/brain more often. otherwise there is no difference between animals and humans.

As far as dressing is concern, if u live in 3rd world country like pakistan or afaganistan then u should dress according to that culture or if u r living in US or canada.. u should dress according to US/Canada's culture..
You Should have a sense, what to wear when and where.
i think that will answer ur question well enough
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star_munir



Joined: 21 Apr 2003
Posts: 1665

PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think culture is important but not like obligatory principle...example if you live in India and like Italian food then God will not punish you which you eat Italian food instead of Indian though you are Indian...same is with dresses I think..Its up to your chocie your own will, which dress in which you find your self more comfirtable..hijab is also a part of culture of Afgahnistan and some countries though it is not allowed in our religion,
wine and bear is also part of western culture though it is forbidden in our religion so I dont think its essentail to dress as per culture...It may be good but not necessary the choice is yours..
you should feel yourself lucky that Ismailis dont need to wear veil...There is no need of physical hijab..the veil of shyness is in heart of true believer..
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VTECMAN786



Joined: 19 Feb 2006
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

star_munir wrote:
I think culture is important but not like obligatory principle...example if you live in India and like Italian food then God will not punish you which you eat Italian food instead of Indian though you are Indian...same is with dresses I think..Its up to your chocie your own will, which dress in which you find your self more comfirtable..hijab is also a part of culture of Afgahnistan and some countries though it is not allowed in our religion,
wine and bear is also part of western culture though it is forbidden in our religion so I dont think its essentail to dress as per culture...It may be good but not necessary the choice is yours..
you should feel yourself lucky that Ismailis dont need to wear veil...There is no need of physical hijab..the veil of shyness is in heart of true believer..


There is no need for a hijab in Islam at all, whether Shi'a or Sunni. There is a need for dressing conservatively, in whatever culture you are in.
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logical



Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 111

PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tuesday, October 17, 2006
EDITORIAL: Muslims must weigh the veil carefully

The British press has quoted Phil Woolas, the Race and Faith minister, as demanding that Aishah Azmi, a Muslim Teaching Assistant, be fired for refusing to remove her veil at work and “in the presence of fellow men workers”.

This remark is bound to pour more oil on the fire of the debate over the rights of Muslim women to wear face-veils in Britain. The opposition Conservatives have also joined the Labour minister, with one of the party’s top officials accusing Muslim leaders of encouraging a “voluntary apartheid” that could help spawn “home-grown terrorism”.

Most Muslim organisations in the UK are outraged........

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2006\10\17\story_17-10-2006_pg3_1
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logical



Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 111

PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2006 2:19 pm    Post subject: Sr. Cleric calls unveiled women 'meat' - target for Rape. Reply with quote

The Times October 27, 2006

Storm after cleric calls unveiled women 'meat'

AUSTRALIA’S most senior Muslim cleric was fighting to keep his position yesterday after likening women who did not wear veils to uncovered meat that attracted predators.

Pls click on link to amuse.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/TGD/tgdBreakingNewsDisplay/0,,3,00.html#3
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Jawad



Joined: 04 Nov 2006
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Sun Nov 05, 2006 12:40 am    Post subject: Hejab Reply with quote

razinizar makes sense however i dont agree with "jesa des, wesa bhes" or "When in Rome" theory... cos it would mean that Islam is not a revolutionary religion but is bound by the man made customs.

Ms Elham... ask your ownself whether you will feel more secure, respected while covering your body properly or not?

I would like to ask everyone a Question.How often do we hear someone saying that look at her dressing today...she is looking soooo 'xyz' in that outfit.

The More the one will expose itself the more the opposite gender is gonna be attracted. Can anyone deny the fact?
God is not Eastern nor Western... And He Himself states "....And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and adornments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers...(a list of exceptions)"[Chapter 24, verses 30-31]
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Admin



Joined: 06 Jan 2003
Posts: 4263

PostPosted: Sun Nov 05, 2006 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mon grand-père a été le premier à inciter les femmes à quitter le voile. Le Coran établit une nette différence entre les femmes-esclaves - celles qui n'existent que dans le regard des hommes, par leurs parures - et les femmes libres. Les femmes doivent être libres, de nos jours, responsables de leur conduite. Il n'est pas question de se cacher, pas plus que de se parer http://www.ismaili.net/intervue/i671015.html Interview Jeune Afrique 15 Oct. 1967


My grandfather was the first to encourage women to get rid of the veil....
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Jawad



Joined: 04 Nov 2006
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:10 am    Post subject: hejab Reply with quote

Allah says: 'O Prophet! Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks (veils) over their bodies (when outdoors). That is most convenient that they should be known and not molested.' (Quran 33:59).

"AND"

Allah says: `It is not for a believer, man or woman, when Allah and His messenger have decreed a matter that they should have an option in their decision. And whoever disobeys Allah and His Messenger, has indeed strayed in a plain error.' (Quran 33:36).
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zubair_mahamood



Joined: 14 Jan 2006
Posts: 238

PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 11:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Hejab Reply with quote

Ya Ali Madad,

Jawad wrote:
razinizar makes sense however i dont agree with "jesa des, wesa bhes" or "When in Rome" theory... cos it would mean that Islam is not a revolutionary religion but is bound by the man made customs.

Ms Elham... ask your ownself whether you will feel more secure, respected while covering your body properly or not?

I would like to ask everyone a Question.How often do we hear someone saying that look at her dressing today...she is looking soooo 'xyz' in that outfit.

The More the one will expose itself the more the opposite gender is gonna be attracted. Can anyone deny the fact?
God is not Eastern nor Western... And He Himself states "....And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and adornments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers...(a list of exceptions)"[Chapter 24, verses 30-31]

Dear Bother Jawad,

I believe in jesa des wesa bhes…. U will also believe when it comes to practical life, just imagine a molve wearing a Kurta Pijama and attending a call centre for a interview… every place has its dressing sense.. If a pujari (with traditional dress) or even Jew (with there little cap) site next to me in train I get scared and try to avoid sitting next to him… when you are talking of someone saying XYZ that means u mean to say dress according to people not according to Islam…

As a Muslim one need to have Hejab on his mind and heart…. Hear getting rid of the veil doesn’t mean getting rid of cloths…. Wearing western dress doesn’t mean wearing short and revealing dresses… why do people have perception that western dress are always XYZ… wear that looks good on u… wear not to distract other….

People feel SOOOOO XYZ looking a girl then my brother I would say if one wants to imagine a girl he will imagine even if she is covered and if one doesn’t want to then he doesn’t… what is important is how you a feel if u also feel xyz then brother I would say Allah will judge people on individual bases and you can correct your self by not getting distracted and controlling ur feeling….
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Jawad



Joined: 04 Nov 2006
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 11:29 am    Post subject: Re: Hejab Reply with quote

Dear Bro Zubair Thanx For Your Contribution,

Quote:
I believe in jesa des wesa bhes…. U will also believe when it comes to practical life,

I have worked for years in Kuwait (E&Y), in NJY (PWC). I think that East & West has quite a lot of values in common. Those uncommon can be managed but sure with a little difficulty, e.g. to manage halal food etc but then that’s the test for us by Allah "And surely We shall try you with something of fear and hunger, and loss of wealth and lives and crops; but give glad tidings to the steadfast (the patient ones)" - (Quran 2:55). A Muslim can adopt to the values of any culture, may it be western as long as it is in consistency with his basic beliefs.

Quote:
just imagine a molve wearing a Kurta Pijama and attending a call centre for a interview… every place has its dressing sense..

LOL... Nowhere did i say that one should wear a kurta and not a 3piece suit. A Woman can surely wear a hejab with shirt & trouser. Islam allows you to wear any dress as long as it covers such body parts of yours as prescribed. I have already given the words of Allah from Quran, wot else can be more convincing.

"... and no one can alter the Words of Allah." (Quran 6:34)
"...in the life of the present world, and in the Hereafter. No change can there be in the Words of Allah, this is indeed the supreme success." (Quran 10:64)

Quote:
If a pujari (with traditional dress) or even Jew (with there little cap) site next to me in train I get scared and try to avoid sitting next to him…
when you are talking of someone saying XYZ that means u mean to say dress according to people not according to Islam…


Not really... i was talking in general. Look a particular dress may expose more of a person's body/figure. lets say a wide neck showing a lady's cleavage will 90 out of 100 times cause sensual delights in males. Sigmund Freud will convince you if he still believed in common sense.

Quote:
As a Muslim one need to have Hejab on his mind and heart…. Hear getting rid of the veil doesn’t mean getting rid of cloths…. Wearing western dress doesn’t mean wearing short and revealing dresses… why do people have perception that western dress are always XYZ… wear that looks good on u… wear not to distract other….

People feel SOOOOO XYZ looking a girl then my brother I would say if one wants to imagine a girl he will imagine even if she is covered and if one doesn’t want to then he doesn’t… what is important is how you a feel if u also feel xyz then brother I would say Allah will judge people on individual bases and you can correct your self by not getting distracted and controlling ur feeling….

Pls tell me this "If a government legalize alcohol trade/ prostitution in our country. Will such a business flourish or not?"

YES IT WILL BECAUSE OF THE EASY ACCESS!!

SelfControl is indeed good yet sources for harmful/immoral things must simultaneously be eliminated.
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zubair_mahamood



Joined: 14 Jan 2006
Posts: 238

PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 3:35 am    Post subject: Re: Hejab Reply with quote

Jawad wrote:
Dear Bro Zubair Thanx For Your Contribution,

Quote:
I believe in jesa des wesa bhes…. U will also believe when it comes to practical life,

I have worked for years in Kuwait (E&Y), in NJY (PWC). I think that East & West has quite a lot of values in common. Those uncommon can be managed but sure with a little difficulty, e.g. to manage halal food etc but then that’s the test for us by Allah "And surely We shall try you with something of fear and hunger, and loss of wealth and lives and crops; but give glad tidings to the steadfast (the patient ones)" - (Quran 2:55). A Muslim can adopt to the values of any culture, may it be western as long as it is in consistency with his basic beliefs.


So u mean to say you also believe Jesa des wesa bhes under Islamic values…. We adapt to cultural values as per west or east under Islam… in west u show today that u are Muslim at school or work place, people around you don’t even reply to you HI (as per image of Muslim today) living in a Islamic country all rights but living in west with traditional outlook often one is victim of discrimination.

Jawad wrote:
Quote:
just imagine a molve wearing a Kurta Pijama and attending a call centre for a interview… every place has its dressing sense..

LOL... Nowhere did i say that one should wear a kurta and not a 3piece suit. A Woman can surely wear a hejab with shirt & trouser. Islam allows you to wear any dress as long as it covers such body parts of yours as prescribed. I have already given the words of Allah from Quran, wot else can be more convincing.

"... and no one can alter the Words of Allah." (Quran 6:34)
"...in the life of the present world, and in the Hereafter. No change can there be in the Words of Allah, this is indeed the supreme success." (Quran 10:64)


Jawad wrote:
Quote:
If a pujari (with traditional dress) or even Jew (with there little cap) site next to me in train I get scared and try to avoid sitting next to him…
when you are talking of someone saying XYZ that means u mean to say dress according to people not according to Islam…


Not really... i was talking in general. Look a particular dress may expose more of a person's body/figure. lets say a wide neck showing a lady's cleavage will 90 out of 100 times cause sensual delights in males. Sigmund Freud will convince you if he still believed in common sense.



Prophet Muhammad is the first person who explained us Quran… he say on the day of Judgement seven people are near to Allah first three are follows:

Hear the person may be boy or girl

1) The person, who in all alone, no one is seeing him and he doesn’t do anything wrong (when people are alone they do lot of things that are forbidden) in that situation a person stops himself only for Allah. Thinking that Allah is watching him and fear’s Allah.

2) The person, who is alone, no one is seeing him and is being invited by women or men for a relationship and the person reject the invitation only for Allah, Thinking that Allah is watching him and fear’s Allah.

3) The person, who is alone, no one is seeing him and is being invited by women or men for something which Islam has forbidden and the person reject the invitation only for Allah, Thinking that Allah is watching him and fear’s Allah.

Now if u follow Quran Follow Prophet….

If your heart is pure you will not possibly get distracted.

No need to go till Quran and Prophet… just follow basic of your home what mothers teach… if one look a girl or women if he thinks she is MY mother, sister, friend or daughter I am sure the feeling your talking will 100% not arise….

You seem to have lot of knowledge of Quran don’t u find verses which tell about purity of heart, fasting, and think of Allah when you’re losing.

Jawad wrote:
Quote:
As a Muslim one need to have Hejab on his mind and heart…. Hear getting rid of the veil doesn’t mean getting rid of cloths…. Wearing western dress doesn’t mean wearing short and revealing dresses… why do people have perception that western dress are always XYZ… wear that looks good on u… wear not to distract other….

People feel SOOOOO XYZ looking a girl then my brother I would say if one wants to imagine a girl he will imagine even if she is covered and if one doesn’t want to then he doesn’t… what is important is how you a feel if u also feel xyz then brother I would say Allah will judge people on individual bases and you can correct your self by not getting distracted and controlling ur feeling….

Pls tell me this "If a government legalize alcohol trade/ prostitution in our country. Will such a business flourish or not?"

YES IT WILL BECAUSE OF THE EASY ACCESS!!

SelfControl is indeed good yet sources for harmful/immoral things must simultaneously be eliminated.


Thank God Kuwait didn’t legalise this things…. it’s legalised in France but I don’t contribute to this industry… it depends on individual to control them selves not the environment they live,.. you can control youself but not enviorment or others.. its good to eliminate immoral things but if one has removed impurity in himself and become pure he is always successfully…I meet some many people who are pure then purity.. one i can never forget.. whom i follow.. seatting in once home or country doesn’t makes follow Islam, Practicing makes you learn and better understand Quran.
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star_munir



Joined: 21 Apr 2003
Posts: 1665

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

End the veil system: Pratibha

Special Correspondent

JAIPUR:

Rajasthan Governor and UPA Presidential candidate Pratibha Patil on Sunday left historians and Muslim social activists astounded by her remarks that the purdah (veil) system was introduced in India to protect women from Mughal aggressors.

Addressing a function marking the 467th birth anniversary of Maharana Pratap at the Nagar Parishad Auditorium in Udaipur, Ms. Patil said though Indian culture always respected women, the veil system began during the Mughal rule to "save women from Mughal invaders."

Ms. Patil said: "Today we are citizens of free India. There is need to put a stop to such practices. That alone will ensure real respect for women. When women are progressing in every field, it is our duty to discontinue such practices."

Historians said the veil system was prevalent much before the Mughal invasion. "There is evidence of construction of separate `zanana' chambers for women in the Chittaurgarh fort in the 11th century," said Varsha Joshi of the Institute of Rajasthan Studies.

Dr. Joshi said women were not allowed to take part in the coronation ceremonies of Rajput rulers, and they were mostly confined to home. "To argue that purdah started because of Mughals amounts to taking a very narrow view of history."

State president of Jamat-e-Islami Hind Mohammed Salim said the opinion that women adopted the veil because of the fear of Mughal rulers reflected the distorted view of history taken by the Sangh Parivar. "It is unfortunate that Ms. Patil found the communal forces' views convincing enough to incorporate them in her address."

"Factually incorrect"

The State secretary of the All-India Milli Council, Abdul Qayoom Akhtar, said Ms. Patil's remarks were "factually incorrect and historically untenable."

"We have been listening to such comments in the false propaganda of Sangh Parivar earlier. It is surprising that Ms. Patil has chosen to agree with the Sangh's line of thinking," he said.

However, Congress spokesperson Param Navdeep, contacted by The Hindu, defended Ms. Patil's remarks, saying they should be seen in the light of the life and times of the erstwhile Mewar ruler. "There should be no controversy about it. It is an established fact that women were the target of aggression during the Mughal rule," she said.
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