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www.ismaili.net :: View topic - Pehlu ray naam saheb jo wado lijiye
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Pehlu ray naam saheb jo wado lijiye

 
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star_munir



Joined: 21 Apr 2003
Posts: 1670

PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 4:57 pm    Post subject: Pehlu ray naam saheb jo wado lijiye Reply with quote

Ya Ali Madad
can any one explain the verse 4 of this Ginan ?I know the translation I would like explanation .

Jeeray bhairey aik anupam shaha morey dhimla dhori sirjiya
te dharti ko thambharhar ho jeeray bhai....
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 19654

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

YAM,

I was trying to look for this Ginan in the Pir Sadardin's Ginan collection. It is listed as being on page 5. However, page 5 has another Ginan. Do you know on which page this Ginan is?

Also you mentioned that you know what it means. I would like to know the meanings of the words dhimla, dhori and thambharhar. They are not in the dictionary that I have.
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star_munir



Joined: 21 Apr 2003
Posts: 1670

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mowla Ali Madad,
dhimal dhori means brown clored animal in urdu and hindi it is called as "bel" I think in English it is called as ox or oxen.

Thambarhar means the one who is holding or giving support or maintaining

So that means that My Mowla made a unique brown bel who has holded this world.

There must be some esoteric meaning of it as literal meanings are not making sense in this case I think.


As in olden times many such legends were famous among ignorant people
like Earth is on head of cow or goat or ox etc and I think it is also in one hadith. According to a mythological legend snake is holding earth.


But as this is in Ginan it can not be wrong. There must be esoteric meaning of it.

In verse 5 it is that My Mowla has made all humans from same egg among them are hindus also and muslims also.

If you want me to write this Ginan which is of 14 verses than I can do that.
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 19654

PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

YAM Munir,

In making any knd of metaphorical interpretation we would need to know in what manner was the animal a pivot or support for the society. Can we compare it with for example the camel in the desert societies?

Also, I think it would help if we knew the other verses. They might be related.
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star_munir



Joined: 21 Apr 2003
Posts: 1670

PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mowla Ali Madad

Here I am writing the Ginan

Jeeray bhairay pehlu ray naam saheb jo wado lijey
bhai dhan dhan rair viari ho jeeray bhai.......1


Jeeray bhairey amber ney dharti Shaha moro tribhuvan sirjiya
bhairey wan rey thambhey aasmaan ho jeeray bhai......2


Jeeray bhairey chandar sooraj shaha morey deepak sirjiya
te lai ne dhariya aasmaan ho jeeray bhai.......3


Jeeray bhairey aik anupam shaha morey dhimla dhori sirjiya
te dharti ka thambarhar ho jeeray bhai.........4


Jeeray bhairey aik indaj mai shaha morey maidni sirji
te ma hindu hindu musalmaan ho jeeray bhai......5


Jeeray bhairey ghar rey Imam jay ahein dio rey dasond
bhai ma kario hin duniya say pyaar ho jeeray bhai.......6



Jeeray bhairey tamara diya shaha morey hajrat likhiya
tey hoojor saheb jay darbaar ho jeeray bhai........ 7


Jeeray bhairey til rey tafawat ka shaha moro lekho leshey
teni satgur poorey chey saankh ho jeeray bhai.....8



Jeeray bhairey chor ney safh ka tiyan hoyseey noveera
Agaal tulsi a meejan ho jeeray bhai ........9


Jeeray bhairey paacham thi aapna khudavind aavashey
bhai sita rey rath a plar ho jeeray bhai...........10



Jeeray bhairey sita rey sen shaha ja sita rey nishaan
Shah ja tambal wajan shaha farmaan ho jeeray bhai......11


Jeeray bhairey gadh aalmout mai shaha morey takht a rachaya
aapno saami rajo baitho kheema khori ho jeeray bhai......12


Jeeray bhairey paacham thi aapno Khudawind aawashey
te jampudeep manjar ho jeeray bhai........13

Jeeray bhai boliya Pir Sadardin tamey sacho sahi kari jano
Aapn[r]o saami rajo aavashee nirvaan ho jeeray bhai.....14
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kmaherali



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 19654

PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 6:56 am    Post subject: Dhimal Dhori Reply with quote

To me it sounds more like 'dori', a kind of a incomparable ('anupam') string that binds particles together, hence called 'thambharhar' - support. It can be construed to mean gravitational pull or force.

A long shot - string theory to make sense of creation, i.e intellectual support.
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star_munir



Joined: 21 Apr 2003
Posts: 1670

PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2005 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you very much for this explanation.
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Admin



Joined: 06 Jan 2003
Posts: 5907

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

star_munir wrote:
Mowla Ali Madad

Here I am writing the Ginan

Jeeray bhairay pehlu ray naam saheb jo wado lijey
bhai dhan dhan rair viari ho jeeray bhai.......1


Jeeray bhairey amber ney dharti Shaha moro tribhuvan sirjiya
bhairey wan rey thambhey aasmaan ho jeeray bhai......2


Jeeray bhairey chandar sooraj shaha morey deepak sirjiya
te lai ne dhariya aasmaan ho jeeray bhai.......3



Needs more research. Was it ever published by Mukhi Devraj or did he left it unpublished?

Here from a Khojki manuscript from Punjab:

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AJD



Joined: 23 Sep 2017
Posts: 25

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to my study, which is an unending process, this ginan was published by Lalji Devraj in 100 Ginānni Chopaḍi: Bhāg Chotho. Bombay, 1932 in Khojki. It was then published in Mahān Īsmāīlī Saṅt Pīr Sadardin Rachit Gīnānono Saṅgrah 1. Bombay, 1952. [Gujarati]

I have studied no less than 4 manuscripts for this ginan dating back to second half of 17th sentury and early 18th century. The highest number of verses I found was 16 in one of these manuscripts.

Generally speaking, this ginan is found more in manuscripts occuring in Punjab. However, manuscripts from other parts of India and Pakistan also contain this ginan.

Thank You!!
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